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Why did anyone believe M$'s hype about cross-platform .Net development? It was only a matter of time. Now Mac OS X is clearly a second class citizen. Anyone who

by cutler 3y ago

Why did anyone believe M$'s hype about cross-platform .Net development? It was only a matter of time. Now Mac OS X is clearly a second class citizen. Anyone who lived through the late 90s/early 2000s will not be surprised. I also don't believe all the VS Code love. Sooner or later M$ will turn the screw.

kcartlidge 3y ago
DotNet is great for cross-platform. Native builds cross-compiled with a huge standard library and excellent performance. This is just about IDE priorities, and even though I use it I understand that VS Mac was always niche. Linux dotnet devs use VS Code or Rider anyway so no change there, and this just brings Mac in line with them. Worth remembering in all this that the developers of Go, Python, PHP, Ruby etc (to name a few, all of which I use and am not dissing) don't produce their own IDEs. You wouldn't expect them too, and would never say their cross-platform creds are bad because of it, so why is MS different just because they choose to produce optional extras beyond the basic language tooling? By that logic you'd have to reach the (ridiculous) conclusion that Go, Python, PHP, Ruby etc are even worse for cross-platform. Double standards really.
shortrounddev2 3y ago
Did you ever use Visual Studio on mac? It's not the same thing as VS on Windows, at all. They just bought another IDE and rebranded it. If you want to do Cross platform .Net development, I would use VS Code for it. Plus, when they said "cross-platform", I think they were thinking more about backend linux than they were about frontend mac/iOS.
- WorldMaker 3y ago
  Yeah, to my understanding Visual Studio for Mac was a fork of MonoDevelop [0]. Microsoft does also mean mac/iOS frontend for cross-platform. There's a cross-platform MAUI Extension for VS Code in Preview: https://devblogs.microsoft.com/visualstudio/announcing-the-dotnet-maui-extension-for-visual-studio-code/ https://devblogs.microsoft.com/visualstudio/announcing-the-d... [0] https://www.monodevelop.com/ https://www.monodevelop.com/
- cutler 3y ago
  > they were thinking more about backend linux than they were about frontend mac/iOS How can that be when they were/are pushing .Net MAUI so hard?
  - shortrounddev2 3y ago
    I didn't say macos wasn't a target, just that it's less important than other platforms. It's a small share of the market
- cutler 3y ago
  Yes I did use it. I'm not saying VS Mac was comparable to VS Windows in fact I had my doubts about M$'s cross-platform development hype throughout the VS Mac saga. The point is the M$ don't give a **ck about anything other than restoring their monopoly position through Windows. Their concession to Linux happened whilst they were fleecing Red Hat and SuSe with bogus Linux patents and financing SCO's disastrous UNIX lawsuit. M$ will never change.
  - shortrounddev2 3y ago
    Your use of M$ makes it very hard to take you seriously tbh
dgellow 3y ago
That has nothing to do with .Net cross platform, it’s about having one cross platform dev environment (VSCode + C# Dev Kit) instead of continue to maintain both the old code base of VS for Mac (previously Xamarin Stduio, previously MonoDevelop) in addition to VSCode.
- cutler 3y ago
  That's no excuse. M$ has the resources to make VS Mac fully compatible with VS Windows. They just chose to keep the Mac version a second-class citizen.

by cutler 3y ago

kcartlidge 3y ago

DotNet is great for cross-platform. Native builds cross-compiled with a huge standard library and excellent performance. This is just about IDE priorities, and even though I use it I understand that VS Mac was always niche. Linux dotnet devs use VS Code or Rider anyway so no change there, and this just brings Mac in line with them. Worth remembering in all this that the developers of Go, Python, PHP, Ruby etc (to name a few, all of which I use and am not dissing) don't produce their own IDEs. You wouldn't expect them too, and would never say their cross-platform creds are bad because of it, so why is MS different just because they choose to produce optional extras beyond the basic language tooling? By that logic you'd have to reach the (ridiculous) conclusion that Go, Python, PHP, Ruby etc are even worse for cross-platform. Double standards really.

shortrounddev2 3y ago

Did you ever use Visual Studio on mac? It's not the same thing as VS on Windows, at all. They just bought another IDE and rebranded it. If you want to do Cross platform .Net development, I would use VS Code for it. Plus, when they said "cross-platform", I think they were thinking more about backend linux than they were about frontend mac/iOS.

WorldMaker 3y ago
Yeah, to my understanding Visual Studio for Mac was a fork of MonoDevelop [0]. Microsoft does also mean mac/iOS frontend for cross-platform. There's a cross-platform MAUI Extension for VS Code in Preview: https://devblogs.microsoft.com/visualstudio/announcing-the-dotnet-maui-extension-for-visual-studio-code/ https://devblogs.microsoft.com/visualstudio/announcing-the-d... [0] https://www.monodevelop.com/ https://www.monodevelop.com/
cutler 3y ago
> they were thinking more about backend linux than they were about frontend mac/iOS How can that be when they were/are pushing .Net MAUI so hard?
- shortrounddev2 3y ago
  I didn't say macos wasn't a target, just that it's less important than other platforms. It's a small share of the market
cutler 3y ago
Yes I did use it. I'm not saying VS Mac was comparable to VS Windows in fact I had my doubts about M$'s cross-platform development hype throughout the VS Mac saga. The point is the M$ don't give a **ck about anything other than restoring their monopoly position through Windows. Their concession to Linux happened whilst they were fleecing Red Hat and SuSe with bogus Linux patents and financing SCO's disastrous UNIX lawsuit. M$ will never change.
- shortrounddev2 3y ago
  Your use of M$ makes it very hard to take you seriously tbh

dgellow 3y ago

That has nothing to do with .Net cross platform, it’s about having one cross platform dev environment (VSCode + C# Dev Kit) instead of continue to maintain both the old code base of VS for Mac (previously Xamarin Stduio, previously MonoDevelop) in addition to VSCode.

cutler 3y ago
That's no excuse. M$ has the resources to make VS Mac fully compatible with VS Windows. They just chose to keep the Mac version a second-class citizen.