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> While the atrocities and punishments by "upper" caste people on "lower" caste people continue, even OBCs oppress SCs and STs quite badly [...]. This is the s
by rollcat 3y ago
> While the atrocities and punishments by "upper" caste people on "lower" caste people continue, even OBCs oppress SCs and STs quite badly [...].
This is the step 1. in ensuring any oppressive system continues to be supported by a majority / critical mass of people, who are themselves subject to oppression: make sure there's someone even lower than you, on whom you can unleash your frustration.
- alephnerd 3y agoThe issue is OBC (Other Backwards Castes) was invented as a populist measure in 1992. After Independence, Affirmative Action/Reservation was created so Dalits and Nomadic Tribes who were traditionally outcastes in South Asian society could be integrated into society. Yet, in the 1980s-90s, Agrarian and Feudal Caste politicians like Mulayam Singh Yadav (Yadav), Lalu Prasad Yadav (Yadav), Chaudhary Charan Singh (Jatt), Bal Thackarey (Maratha), YRS Reddy (Reddy), etc began pushing to expand Affirmative Action to include those castes that are traditionally Feudal Lords/Zamindars and oppressed Dalits and Nomads. When this expansion began in 1992, every single non-Dalit caste saw that if they could lobby hard enough, they could also be give guarunteed Affirmative Action for college admissions, government jobs, welfare, etc. This is why even some Brahmin majority castes like Paharis were given Affimative Action by being treated as an OBC or Scheduled Tribe.
- WesolyKubeczek 3y agoSo it’s like playing a fake victim card?
- rhaway84773 3y agoAnd yet 1 out of 180 CS professors are OBCs despite the population being over 40%. It’s probably closer to the welfare queen trope. Yeah, there are a few people who cheat the system, like any other system in the world. Thaw existence of cheaters does not negate the very real problems and challenges faced by the actual “victims”.
- varunpant 3y ago[flagged]
- Philpax 3y agoYes, and?
- OkayPhysicist 3y agoDude really said the quiet part out loud. Caste discrimination is just another kind of bigotry, like sexism and racism.
- UncleMeat 3y ago1/180 is very very very different than 4/10. That's not just some statistical anomaly.
- lozenge 3y agoThere's nothing biologically different about these people. The only difference is how they're treated by society.
- michaelchisari 3y agoI'm not one who believes that perfect representational parity is possible or even desirable within all social groupings. That said, I see no reason to ignore the implication of a 1% vs 40% disparity within a highly advantageous profession.
- kelnos 3y agoRight, they absolutely should fight for equal representation. The numbers aren't always going to be exactly equal to representation, sure. But when you have a group that comprises 40% of society only represented by a half percent in prestigious university faculty positions, you need to step back and figure out what's going on there. These people are not genetically different or of lower intelligence; they've literally been not allowed to hold these positions even if they wanted them and could be qualified for them. Frankly, your point of view is advocating for bigotry and oppression, and I suggest you re-evaluate why that is so.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- alephnerd 3y agoNot exactly. There is a very real economic divide between rural India and urban India. Even if you were from a feudal landlord family, 30 years ago you might have not even had running water or electricity. But at least you had a solid house, instead of living in a mud hut (if you were lucky) like most Dalits and Nomads in rural India back then. If someone from an elite rural family came to the city, their privilige automatically becomes moot because in a purely capitalist society Money begets Privilige. In the 1990s-to-present, there was a massive migration from rural India to cities, and a number of formerly priviliged Men (it's men who become migrant workers) were at the bottom rung of the urban social ladder. And they were/are PISSED. So in retaliation, they began organizing their own Castes to fight for political power and quotas. Also, in India, Affirmative Action is a Quota System, unlike the US where Quotas are unconstitutional. This means you are playing a Zero Sum game where one family's Affirmative Action might doom your family to poverty. This makes the situation highly volatile.
- hef19898 3y ago[flagged]
- cududa 3y agoWhat "sort of problems" do you mean, exactly?
- hef19898 3y agoSchhol shootings in the US, Neo-Nazis in East Germany, islamist terrorists. They all have in common of being, over simplifying, frustrated, in secure young men. They are easily manipulated by populists and ideologists, prone to use violence and prone to be sexist, racist etc. I guess that is becaise the way they see themselves, or what they think society expects them to be, is something they do not get. Hence the incredible amount of frustration. Frustration that breeds, especially when combined with a sense of entitlement and inhrained superiority, radicals like nothing else. Bonus points if thes can see themselves as the victims, conspiracy theories go a long way in building some groups conspiring against them.
- yttribium 3y agoIdentical phenomenon exists in US where groups with well above average incomes are considered officially "disadvantaged groups" for purposes of eg SBA loans.
- alephnerd 3y ago[flagged]
- yttribium 3y agoThe United States absolutely does have multiple quota systems in different domains. https://selectgcr.com/blog/minority-owned-businesses-how-to-get-government-contracts/ https://selectgcr.com/blog/minority-owned-businesses-how-to-...
- orzig 3y agoI’m willing to believe it, but you’re making a claim which should be trivial to back up with sources, so please do (or I’ll have to assume you can’t)
- dfadsadsf 3y agoThe most obvious one is that Asian American are considered “disadvantaged” group for getting SBA loans which makes zero sense (highest earning group in US). They also qualify for minority-owned business status that opens up gov contracting opportunities.
- newyankee 3y agoBal Thackeray is no way a Maratha, although he fought for Marathi and Hindu identity. Just shows how complex things are. Also the PM is OBC for what I know off.
- rhuru 3y agoOBC is indeed a completely made up category and has no relation to any kind of historic "atrocities". OBCs are > 50% of India's population my some measure which tells you they are extremely powerful in an democracy. They engage in this race to bottom where they want more legal discrimination that favors them at the expense of another. One can easily see that the most powerful politicians everywhere in India are mostly OBC. India's current PM is an OBC, so is the CMs of some of the richest states like Maharahstra, Tamilnadu or the most populous states like Uttar Pradesh. Making a claim that this group is somehow "oppressed" is like claiming Teachers Unions or NRA being politically oppressed. It is other way around.
- munificent 3y agoLyndon B. Johnson: "If you can convince the lowest white man he's better than the best colored man, he won't notice you're picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he'll empty his pockets for you."
- naniid 3y agoReminds me of ragging in Indian colleges. There is no particular generation thinks that they should put a full stop to this. Their insane justification is “we bore it, now it’s our turn to do it”. Society is just f*^ed up. Same with caste system.