11 ms·

Yeah, because waterfall with iterations is better than SCRUM/AGILE/WHATEVER. God intended water to run from the TOP to the BOTTOM. Don't fight gravity.

by mrmlz 3y ago

psunavy03 3y ago
[flagged]
atoav 3y ago
The best results I have ever seen have been projects that people on the bottom did themselves, because they needed it without the people on the top ever knowing about it. The worst results I have ever seen have been projects where the people on the bottom stopped caring because the people on the top tried to make them ignore the laws of nature. Also: God is dead
- mrmlz 3y ago
  I'm not really sure what you are arguing. Of course if its a one man job (or a couple) and the .. product or whatever isn't system/safety critical even having a PM is probably overkill and the overhead of "any" process likely just wrecks the output. But if you need to organize 50+ engineers and actually produce a ... product? That people/agencies/customers expect things of you sure as shit is going to need a definable goal, verifiable output and a somewhat chronological way of achieveing that. Waterfall it is (with reasonable iterations).
  - bratbag 3y ago
    Good luck building a chronology for 50+ engineers ahead of time that isn't either horrifically over estimated or instantly wrong. Waterfall is a pacifier for people who would rather have lies than uncertainty.
    - mrmlz 3y ago
      Sure time estimation in developmentprojects is hard (impossible?), but thats hard in both waterfall and agile or whatever. But the often used CER -> PDR -> CDR -> TRR etc. is damn useful.
    - datadrivenangel 3y ago
      >Waterfall is a pacifier for people who would rather have lies than uncertainty. This is the truth. It's painful to see, but some people would prefer to light millions of dollars on fire than admit they don't know.
      - psunavy03 3y ago
        It's not just about "admitting they don't know." It's about giving up the control that they've used to define their entire professional lives as "managers." Thank you Frederick Winslow Taylor for your outdated ideas.

Yeah, because waterfall with iterations is better than SCRUM/AGILE/WHATEVER. God intended water to run from the TOP to the BOTTOM. Don't fight gravity.

by mrmlz 3y ago

Yeah, because waterfall with iterations is better than SCRUM/AGILE/WHATEVER. God intended water to run from the TOP to the BOTTOM. Don't fight gravity.

psunavy03 3y ago

[flagged]

atoav 3y ago

The best results I have ever seen have been projects that people on the bottom did themselves, because they needed it without the people on the top ever knowing about it. The worst results I have ever seen have been projects where the people on the bottom stopped caring because the people on the top tried to make them ignore the laws of nature. Also: God is dead

mrmlz 3y ago
I'm not really sure what you are arguing. Of course if its a one man job (or a couple) and the .. product or whatever isn't system/safety critical even having a PM is probably overkill and the overhead of "any" process likely just wrecks the output. But if you need to organize 50+ engineers and actually produce a ... product? That people/agencies/customers expect things of you sure as shit is going to need a definable goal, verifiable output and a somewhat chronological way of achieveing that. Waterfall it is (with reasonable iterations).
- bratbag 3y ago
  Good luck building a chronology for 50+ engineers ahead of time that isn't either horrifically over estimated or instantly wrong. Waterfall is a pacifier for people who would rather have lies than uncertainty.
  - mrmlz 3y ago
    Sure time estimation in developmentprojects is hard (impossible?), but thats hard in both waterfall and agile or whatever. But the often used CER -> PDR -> CDR -> TRR etc. is damn useful.
  - datadrivenangel 3y ago
    >Waterfall is a pacifier for people who would rather have lies than uncertainty. This is the truth. It's painful to see, but some people would prefer to light millions of dollars on fire than admit they don't know.
    - psunavy03 3y ago
      It's not just about "admitting they don't know." It's about giving up the control that they've used to define their entire professional lives as "managers." Thank you Frederick Winslow Taylor for your outdated ideas.