6 ms·

That all seems rather ad hominem, while not talking about the value of the information. All sources are biased; some are more useful than others.

pphysch 3y ago
As I said, it has some signal but we must take their analysis with a huge grain of salt because they are closely associated with actual conspirators behind the conflict.
- labster 3y ago
  I have a hard time believing that the Biden administration got the US Senate to confirm a member of Putin’s inner circle to the US State Dept. But we have Lord Lebedev as an example that weird things like this do happen.
  - pphysch 3y ago
    Perhaps you aren't as informed about the recent political history of Ukraine as you imagine.
    - labster 3y ago
      No political history of Ukraine is necessary to identify the conspirators behind the war, as you put it. The decision to invade was made solely in Moscow. It cannot have been otherwise.
      - pphysch 3y ago
        It is concerning that this sort of blatant anti-intellectualism is popular and accepted nowadays. Here are a couple of insightful talks by esteemed American academics that shed some light on this dark period: https://www.youtube.com/live/qciVozNtCDM?feature=shared https://www.youtube.com/live/qciVozNtCDM?feature=shared https://youtu.be/TAYTBiVJt4Y?feature=shared https://youtu.be/TAYTBiVJt4Y?feature=shared
        kemotep 3y ago
        So the problem with realism is why does Ukraine not have any agency of their own? Why does only Russia or the United States have a say and not the Ukrainian people about who they want to be allied with? In my opinion it is John Mearshiemer is misinformed. One thing he gets wrong is that he says Putin did not say anything about wanting to conquer Ukraine despite all evidence to the contrary.
        pphysch 3y ago
        > So the problem with realism is why does Ukraine not have any agency of their own? Before the war, US media agreed Ukraine was one of if not the most corrupt country in Europe. I mean, just look at what both Trump and the Bidens got away with. There is also an enormous propaganda apparatus operating on Ukrainian minds. Look how Zelensky got essentially elected by a fictional TV show produced by a notorious oligarch. So yes, it is correct to question how much genuine "Ukrainian" political will exists in relation to the whims of powerful oligarchs and foreign powers (US, Russia, EU). You really want me to believe that it is the Ukrainian national will to be slaughtered to prevent the corrupt Russian-speaking guy in Kiev being replaced by a corrupt Russian-speaking guy in Moscow? And that it is purely a coincidence that faraway Washington+London are extremely enthusiastic about this outcome? > In my opinion it is John Mearshiemer is misinformed. One thing he gets wrong is that he says Putin did not say anything about wanting to conquer Ukraine despite all evidence to the contrary. He explicitly invited the audience to provide this "evidence". I invite you to do the same.
        kemotep 3y ago
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_the_Historical_Unity_of_Russians_and_Ukrainians?wprov=sfti1 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_the_Historical_Unity_of_Rus... And then there is the actual annexation of Crimea in 2014 and Kherson, Zaporizhzhia, Donetsk, and Luhansk Oblasts in 2022. If annexation was not his goal, why did he, why these specific ones that create a land bridge for Crimea, and why was the Russian constitution updated to include these territories? I will not deny any allegations of Ukrainian corruption, that is an issue they will have to work through. Even the United States is not innocent when it comes to political graft. But one is a country that is defending itself from an invading force and the other side is invading. It doesn’t get any more cut and dry here. Your other arguments are literally Russian talking points to justify the invasion so I can hardly accept them in good faith. That Ukraine doesn’t have any actual agency. I’m claiming Russia is invading because Ukraine wants to exercise their own sovereignty and you are agreeing with Russia that Ukraine does not and is just a puppet. Realists need to explain why Ukraine, and only Ukraine, in this situation is unable to have agency yet London, Washington, and Moscow are the only ones capable of having agency.

pphysch 3y ago

As I said, it has some signal but we must take their analysis with a huge grain of salt because they are closely associated with actual conspirators behind the conflict.

labster 3y ago
I have a hard time believing that the Biden administration got the US Senate to confirm a member of Putin’s inner circle to the US State Dept. But we have Lord Lebedev as an example that weird things like this do happen.
- pphysch 3y ago
  Perhaps you aren't as informed about the recent political history of Ukraine as you imagine.
  - labster 3y ago
    No political history of Ukraine is necessary to identify the conspirators behind the war, as you put it. The decision to invade was made solely in Moscow. It cannot have been otherwise.
    - pphysch 3y ago
      It is concerning that this sort of blatant anti-intellectualism is popular and accepted nowadays. Here are a couple of insightful talks by esteemed American academics that shed some light on this dark period: https://www.youtube.com/live/qciVozNtCDM?feature=shared https://www.youtube.com/live/qciVozNtCDM?feature=shared https://youtu.be/TAYTBiVJt4Y?feature=shared https://youtu.be/TAYTBiVJt4Y?feature=shared
      - kemotep 3y ago
        So the problem with realism is why does Ukraine not have any agency of their own? Why does only Russia or the United States have a say and not the Ukrainian people about who they want to be allied with? In my opinion it is John Mearshiemer is misinformed. One thing he gets wrong is that he says Putin did not say anything about wanting to conquer Ukraine despite all evidence to the contrary.
        pphysch 3y ago
        > So the problem with realism is why does Ukraine not have any agency of their own? Before the war, US media agreed Ukraine was one of if not the most corrupt country in Europe. I mean, just look at what both Trump and the Bidens got away with. There is also an enormous propaganda apparatus operating on Ukrainian minds. Look how Zelensky got essentially elected by a fictional TV show produced by a notorious oligarch. So yes, it is correct to question how much genuine "Ukrainian" political will exists in relation to the whims of powerful oligarchs and foreign powers (US, Russia, EU). You really want me to believe that it is the Ukrainian national will to be slaughtered to prevent the corrupt Russian-speaking guy in Kiev being replaced by a corrupt Russian-speaking guy in Moscow? And that it is purely a coincidence that faraway Washington+London are extremely enthusiastic about this outcome? > In my opinion it is John Mearshiemer is misinformed. One thing he gets wrong is that he says Putin did not say anything about wanting to conquer Ukraine despite all evidence to the contrary. He explicitly invited the audience to provide this "evidence". I invite you to do the same.
        kemotep 3y ago
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_the_Historical_Unity_of_Russians_and_Ukrainians?wprov=sfti1 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_the_Historical_Unity_of_Rus... And then there is the actual annexation of Crimea in 2014 and Kherson, Zaporizhzhia, Donetsk, and Luhansk Oblasts in 2022. If annexation was not his goal, why did he, why these specific ones that create a land bridge for Crimea, and why was the Russian constitution updated to include these territories? I will not deny any allegations of Ukrainian corruption, that is an issue they will have to work through. Even the United States is not innocent when it comes to political graft. But one is a country that is defending itself from an invading force and the other side is invading. It doesn’t get any more cut and dry here. Your other arguments are literally Russian talking points to justify the invasion so I can hardly accept them in good faith. That Ukraine doesn’t have any actual agency. I’m claiming Russia is invading because Ukraine wants to exercise their own sovereignty and you are agreeing with Russia that Ukraine does not and is just a puppet. Realists need to explain why Ukraine, and only Ukraine, in this situation is unable to have agency yet London, Washington, and Moscow are the only ones capable of having agency.