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The Constitution binds the government and the government ONLY.

by TylerE 3y ago

twoodfin 3y ago
What did you think I meant by If Cloudflare or anyone else wants to have a different standard, that’s their right, too. But the First Amendment line is neon bright, which is a nice feature. ?
- TylerE 3y ago
  Because the 1st is completely irrelevant to this discussion.
nxm 3y ago
What if the government reaches out to social media company and asks them to police speech that they don’t like, as was the case during Covid/Hunter Biden Laptop?
- Cthulhu_ 3y ago
  And yet it still happened, to the point where thousands died a preventable death. "hunter biden laptop" was always a distraction tactic, just like "but hillary's emails". It was an attempt to muddy the waters and obscure the republican's long list of shit they got up to. Thankfully, we've gone from "fuck around" to the "find out" age now. If Biden did a thing then the legal system will take care of it. That is all.
pyuser583 3y ago
This isn’t even true. The 13th Amendment applies to everybody,
EarlKing 3y ago
No one cares. This is class warfare. The proletariat needs the right to engage in debate free of interference from the bourgeoisie and bourgeoisie-adjacent. You're not going to win anyone over by saying that the law doesn't provide for that. Hang your laws. The natural rights of the proletariat should not be up for negotiation.
- Cthulhu_ 3y ago
  And they ARE free to engage in debate, and they DO - nazis are NOT oppressed in the US. But services like Cloudflare are ALSO free to not platform it. This is the freedom of choosing who to do business with. The "proletariat" can - and do - engage in debate in millions of ways. Else the insurgents couldn't have organized the Jan 6th coup attempt.
  - EarlKing 3y ago
    Calling people you don't like "nazis" doesn't change what you are doing. They are being deprived of their civil rights and no one is fooled. That's why we're having this discussion at all: you've managed to piss off the right people such that the problem isn't being ignored anymore.
    - dragonwriter 3y ago
      > They are being deprived of their civil rights No, they aren't. Freedom of speech is not the right to coerce others into relaying your speech. That is a violation of free speech.
      - EarlKing 3y ago
        Commerce is not the right to arbitrarily deny people services you have freely offered either, but here we are. You people built an edifice at law, called it 'public accommodations', went to great lengths to stretch it as far as possible into a concept of commercial neutrality, and now here it is being applied against you. No one will care whether or not your idiosyncratic definition of 'public accommodations' applies here either. The proletariat's sense of justice has been offended. You did this to yourselves. Choke on it.
        dragonwriter 3y ago
        > Commerce is not the right to arbitrarily deny people services you have freely offered either Yes, it generally is in the US. Legally, there are a small number of narrow exceptions in public accommodations based in historically widespread societal persecution, but those exceptions would not be necessary if the general liberty you deny were not the rule, and even those exceptions which have been established in statute have not-infrequently been narrowed or limited by the courts for infringing on speech, press, and association rights when applied beyond certain limits.

The Constitution binds the government and the government ONLY.

by TylerE 3y ago

The Constitution binds the government and the government ONLY.

What did you think I meant by If Cloudflare or anyone else wants to have a different standard, that’s their right, too. But the First Amendment line is neon bright, which is a nice feature. ?

TylerE 3y ago
Because the 1st is completely irrelevant to this discussion.

nxm 3y ago

What if the government reaches out to social media company and asks them to police speech that they don’t like, as was the case during Covid/Hunter Biden Laptop?

Cthulhu_ 3y ago
And yet it still happened, to the point where thousands died a preventable death. "hunter biden laptop" was always a distraction tactic, just like "but hillary's emails". It was an attempt to muddy the waters and obscure the republican's long list of shit they got up to. Thankfully, we've gone from "fuck around" to the "find out" age now. If Biden did a thing then the legal system will take care of it. That is all.

pyuser583 3y ago

This isn’t even true. The 13th Amendment applies to everybody,

EarlKing 3y ago

No one cares. This is class warfare. The proletariat needs the right to engage in debate free of interference from the bourgeoisie and bourgeoisie-adjacent. You're not going to win anyone over by saying that the law doesn't provide for that. Hang your laws. The natural rights of the proletariat should not be up for negotiation.

Cthulhu_ 3y ago
And they ARE free to engage in debate, and they DO - nazis are NOT oppressed in the US. But services like Cloudflare are ALSO free to not platform it. This is the freedom of choosing who to do business with. The "proletariat" can - and do - engage in debate in millions of ways. Else the insurgents couldn't have organized the Jan 6th coup attempt.
- EarlKing 3y ago
  Calling people you don't like "nazis" doesn't change what you are doing. They are being deprived of their civil rights and no one is fooled. That's why we're having this discussion at all: you've managed to piss off the right people such that the problem isn't being ignored anymore.
  - dragonwriter 3y ago
    > They are being deprived of their civil rights No, they aren't. Freedom of speech is not the right to coerce others into relaying your speech. That is a violation of free speech.
    - EarlKing 3y ago
      Commerce is not the right to arbitrarily deny people services you have freely offered either, but here we are. You people built an edifice at law, called it 'public accommodations', went to great lengths to stretch it as far as possible into a concept of commercial neutrality, and now here it is being applied against you. No one will care whether or not your idiosyncratic definition of 'public accommodations' applies here either. The proletariat's sense of justice has been offended. You did this to yourselves. Choke on it.
      - dragonwriter 3y ago
        > Commerce is not the right to arbitrarily deny people services you have freely offered either Yes, it generally is in the US. Legally, there are a small number of narrow exceptions in public accommodations based in historically widespread societal persecution, but those exceptions would not be necessary if the general liberty you deny were not the rule, and even those exceptions which have been established in statute have not-infrequently been narrowed or limited by the courts for infringing on speech, press, and association rights when applied beyond certain limits.