4 ms·

The TSA misses huge percentages of weapons during the passenger hand luggage searches in repeated blind testing. This means that the standard movie-plot method

by sneak 3y ago

The TSA misses huge percentages of weapons during the passenger hand luggage searches in repeated blind testing. This means that the standard movie-plot methods of hijacking aircraft are ridiculously easy to carry out: just bring weapons on a plane. There's only a 50% chance you get caught. This means approximately no one wants to hijack airliners.

WarOnPrivacy 3y ago
> The TSA misses huge percentages of weapons during the passenger hand luggage searches in repeated blind testing. Between TSA missing most weapons while compulsively stealing cash, travelers would be far safer from genuine harm if the the agency didn't exist. ref: https://reason.com/2021/11/19/after-20-years-of-failure-kill-the-tsa/ https://reason.com/2021/11/19/after-20-years-of-failure-kill... ref: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=tsa+seizes+cash https://duckduckgo.com/?q=tsa+seizes+cash I just learned: It seems that state efforts to maximize gun possession have led to so many guns in airports - even TSA agents are starting to find them. ref: https://www.forbes.com/sites/suzannerowankelleher/2022/11/01/52-million-tsa-fines-loaded-guns-airport/ https://www.forbes.com/sites/suzannerowankelleher/2022/11/01...
- edrxty 3y ago
  I suspect weapon and gun aren't the same thing here. I've accidentallied a ton of knives through TSA checkpoints because they're small and don't show up well against a my giant ball of cables, adapters, and chargers. OTOH, guns tend to be extremely obvious on x ray machines. They, at a minimum, have a fairly heavy steel barrel and the ammunition is solid lead and/or copper which looks like an extremely dark pattern of dots on an X ray. The springs also tend to stick out very strongly as they have a regular pattern and show up well. I'm sure they missed them before, but generally speaking I doubt it's something an attacker can even begin to count on.
  - Alupis 3y ago
    Disassembling a firearm and sticking it's parts inside other regular carry-on items would be sufficient to get past most TSA screenings. I was blown away with my first First-Class flying experience. You go through all this TSA security theater, and then they hand you a real metal steak knife and glass stemware shortly after take off. You don't even need to bring weapons, they give them to you. TSA stuff is all for show. It makes some people feel safer that they had to take off their belt or something...
    - edrxty 3y ago
      You'd still need ammunition and the individual parts still look pretty striking. With a modern polymer firearm you're just going to see the slide and barrel assembly anyway. Go look up some pictures of firearms in luggage, they're pretty obvious even if you just consider the individual parts.
      - Alupis 3y ago
        A barrel inside a curling iron, the spring inside a hair dryer, the slide inside a laptop, the frame does have small metal bits but, depending on their scanning tech, probably wouldn't appear much like a gun. You probably don't even need bullets honestly, just the visual aid. You don't even need a gun though, a knife is plenty lethal on it's own and readily available inside the terminal and even on the plane.
      - sneak 3y ago
        The TSA is blind tested on firearms specifically. They miss lots of them, like 40-70% in various tests. Have you seen the kinds of people they put in that job? The whole thing is a farce.
  - qingcharles 3y ago
    I accidentallied a big knife I had in my bumbag (fanny pack) onto an international flight. And then managed to leave it in the seatback pocket by mistake. I didn't ask for it back.
not2b 3y ago
A repeat of the 9/11 attack became impossible before that day was over. It relied on the passengers and crew cooperating with the hijackers until it was too late: they would think that the plane is being diverted or held for ransom and the safest thing to do would be to go along, because that's how hijacking worked from the 60s through the 90s. But now everyone knows about 9/11, so everyone will fight like hell to prevent the plane from being taken over, because the assumption has become that if the bad guys get control everyone will die, and if the hijackers claim otherwise no one believes that. The bad guys know this: they figure an attempt to do a 9/11-style hijacking will result in failure and death without doing damage to anything but the plane itself. No flying into the Capitol or the Pentagon in a blaze of glory.
- albert_e 3y ago
  So it turned out to be ... the hijack to end all hijacks?
- landemva 3y ago
  Due to procedure changes, and very tough doors into flight deck which are generally locked, and voluntary handgun carry by pilots, US hijacking is not feasible. Yet we pay a ticket surcharge to get TSA groped and our privacy violated. Americans won't see the enemy which is staring at us. Domestically it will have to get a lot worse over the next decade.

by sneak 3y ago

WarOnPrivacy 3y ago

> The TSA misses huge percentages of weapons during the passenger hand luggage searches in repeated blind testing. Between TSA missing most weapons while compulsively stealing cash, travelers would be far safer from genuine harm if the the agency didn't exist. ref: https://reason.com/2021/11/19/after-20-years-of-failure-kill-the-tsa/ https://reason.com/2021/11/19/after-20-years-of-failure-kill... ref: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=tsa+seizes+cash https://duckduckgo.com/?q=tsa+seizes+cash I just learned: It seems that state efforts to maximize gun possession have led to so many guns in airports - even TSA agents are starting to find them. ref: https://www.forbes.com/sites/suzannerowankelleher/2022/11/01/52-million-tsa-fines-loaded-guns-airport/ https://www.forbes.com/sites/suzannerowankelleher/2022/11/01...

edrxty 3y ago
I suspect weapon and gun aren't the same thing here. I've accidentallied a ton of knives through TSA checkpoints because they're small and don't show up well against a my giant ball of cables, adapters, and chargers. OTOH, guns tend to be extremely obvious on x ray machines. They, at a minimum, have a fairly heavy steel barrel and the ammunition is solid lead and/or copper which looks like an extremely dark pattern of dots on an X ray. The springs also tend to stick out very strongly as they have a regular pattern and show up well. I'm sure they missed them before, but generally speaking I doubt it's something an attacker can even begin to count on.
- Alupis 3y ago
  Disassembling a firearm and sticking it's parts inside other regular carry-on items would be sufficient to get past most TSA screenings. I was blown away with my first First-Class flying experience. You go through all this TSA security theater, and then they hand you a real metal steak knife and glass stemware shortly after take off. You don't even need to bring weapons, they give them to you. TSA stuff is all for show. It makes some people feel safer that they had to take off their belt or something...
  - edrxty 3y ago
    You'd still need ammunition and the individual parts still look pretty striking. With a modern polymer firearm you're just going to see the slide and barrel assembly anyway. Go look up some pictures of firearms in luggage, they're pretty obvious even if you just consider the individual parts.
    - Alupis 3y ago
      A barrel inside a curling iron, the spring inside a hair dryer, the slide inside a laptop, the frame does have small metal bits but, depending on their scanning tech, probably wouldn't appear much like a gun. You probably don't even need bullets honestly, just the visual aid. You don't even need a gun though, a knife is plenty lethal on it's own and readily available inside the terminal and even on the plane.
    - sneak 3y ago
      The TSA is blind tested on firearms specifically. They miss lots of them, like 40-70% in various tests. Have you seen the kinds of people they put in that job? The whole thing is a farce.
- qingcharles 3y ago
  I accidentallied a big knife I had in my bumbag (fanny pack) onto an international flight. And then managed to leave it in the seatback pocket by mistake. I didn't ask for it back.

not2b 3y ago

A repeat of the 9/11 attack became impossible before that day was over. It relied on the passengers and crew cooperating with the hijackers until it was too late: they would think that the plane is being diverted or held for ransom and the safest thing to do would be to go along, because that's how hijacking worked from the 60s through the 90s. But now everyone knows about 9/11, so everyone will fight like hell to prevent the plane from being taken over, because the assumption has become that if the bad guys get control everyone will die, and if the hijackers claim otherwise no one believes that. The bad guys know this: they figure an attempt to do a 9/11-style hijacking will result in failure and death without doing damage to anything but the plane itself. No flying into the Capitol or the Pentagon in a blaze of glory.

albert_e 3y ago
So it turned out to be ... the hijack to end all hijacks?
landemva 3y ago
Due to procedure changes, and very tough doors into flight deck which are generally locked, and voluntary handgun carry by pilots, US hijacking is not feasible. Yet we pay a ticket surcharge to get TSA groped and our privacy violated. Americans won't see the enemy which is staring at us. Domestically it will have to get a lot worse over the next decade.