5 ms·

I'm all for right-to-repair but if they hate their machines so much why isn't McD addressing the problem?

jandrese 3y ago
The franchisees hate the machines, but some people at the corporate level are I'm sure very happy with the big stacks of cash Taylor provides to insure the exclusivity. Reputational brand damage from having always broken Ice Cream machines is apparently less of a concern than losing those sweet greenbacks.
- phonon 3y ago
  There is no exclusivity. Franchisees can buy Carpigiani machines instead...but... "(McDonald’s agreement with franchisees also allows them to use an actual Italian machine, sold by Bologna-based Carpigiani, that McD Truth describes as much better designed. But given that its replacement parts can take a week to arrive from Italy, far fewer restaurants buy it.)" [1] [1] https://www.wired.com/story/they-hacked-mcdonalds-ice-cream-makers-started-cold-war/#:~:text=McDonald%E2%80%99s%20agreement%20with%20franchisees%20also%20allows%20them%20to%20use%20an%20actual%20Italian%20machine%2C%20sold%20by%20Bologna%2Dbased%20Carpigiani%2C https://www.wired.com/story/they-hacked-mcdonalds-ice-cream-...
  - netsharc 3y ago
    Seem like there's a market to be a buyer of a few thousand of the Italian machines state-side, in complete (for selling) and in parts (for repairs).
    - kyleee 3y ago
      Sounds expensive to get started but I wish someone would just to compete with the corrupt idiots at Taylor
    - phonon 3y ago
      Seems like they are pretty good! "Then there is the Carpigiani K3. Take all the issues with the Taylor C602 and fix them and then you have a K3. It's by far the better machine with tech support that anyone can call into. The only complaint is that most of the parameters are initialized before being translated from German to English." https://old.reddit.com/r/videos/comments/jd2tbq/mcdonalds_ice_cream_machine/g981utj/ https://old.reddit.com/r/videos/comments/jd2tbq/mcdonalds_ic...
      - netsharc 3y ago
        I hope it has a screen somewhere that says "DAS MASCHINE IST NICHT FÜR DER GEFINGERPOKEN UND MITTENGRABEN".
      - jaclaz 3y ago
        Maybe the machines the poster on Reddit saw/dealt with were modified, Carpigiani is Italian[1], so while it is well possible that some settings are not translated from Italian to English, it is unlikely that they were "natively" in German. [1] Specifically from Emilia Romagna, not far from Ravenna, i.e. it is not the case of a bi-lingual Italian/German region such as Trentino Alto Adige.
blamazon 3y ago
Like many corporations nowadays, McDonald's is basically a real estate holding company. The actual franchised businesses that operate on their land are tenants, and as their landlord, McDonald's is, IMO, only incentivized to help them succeed financially insomuch as they desire to collect as much rent from them as possible. This ice cream machine thing is, IMO, an obfuscated method of transferring more value from the ground level businesses to McD's corporate, via the Taylor machine vendor middleman. In other words, paying more rent.
- kyleee 3y ago
  I think more money is going to Taylor in recurring service revenue. But there were probably kickbacks to McDs when the use of this machine was mandated
  - blamazon 3y ago
    Kick-back doesn't have to be a one time thing - my guess (unsubstantiated) is the contracts involved routinely time out, requiring more 'golf-course negotiations.'
    - ghostpepper 3y ago
      That would mean there should be even more evidence laying around, no?
      - blamazon 3y ago
        In theory yes, but in practice, I feel that the transferred value could be ambiguous and obfuscated, even intangible. I would be surprised if McDonald's doesn't have a world class general counsel and legal team that can get very creative. I readily acknowledge this is a cynically conspiratorial take with no evidential basis.
  - gruez 3y ago
    >>This ice cream machine thing is, IMO, an obfuscated method of transferring more value from the ground level businesses to McD's corporate, via the Taylor machine vendor middleman. In other words, paying more rent. >But there were probably kickbacks to McDs when the use of this machine was mandated I see this being insinuated since day 1, but after 2 years of lawsuits no document has surfaced during discovery to support this claim. I realize absence of proof isn't proof of absence, but given how much this piece of evidence will help Kytch's case, if not in court of law then in the court of public opinion, I'm inclined to tentatively conclude no such malfeasance has occurred.

The franchisees hate the machines, but some people at the corporate level are I'm sure very happy with the big stacks of cash Taylor provides to insure the exclusivity. Reputational brand damage from having always broken Ice Cream machines is apparently less of a concern than losing those sweet greenbacks.

phonon 3y ago
There is no exclusivity. Franchisees can buy Carpigiani machines instead...but... "(McDonald’s agreement with franchisees also allows them to use an actual Italian machine, sold by Bologna-based Carpigiani, that McD Truth describes as much better designed. But given that its replacement parts can take a week to arrive from Italy, far fewer restaurants buy it.)" [1] [1] https://www.wired.com/story/they-hacked-mcdonalds-ice-cream-makers-started-cold-war/#:~:text=McDonald%E2%80%99s%20agreement%20with%20franchisees%20also%20allows%20them%20to%20use%20an%20actual%20Italian%20machine%2C%20sold%20by%20Bologna%2Dbased%20Carpigiani%2C https://www.wired.com/story/they-hacked-mcdonalds-ice-cream-...
- netsharc 3y ago
  Seem like there's a market to be a buyer of a few thousand of the Italian machines state-side, in complete (for selling) and in parts (for repairs).
  - kyleee 3y ago
    Sounds expensive to get started but I wish someone would just to compete with the corrupt idiots at Taylor
  - phonon 3y ago
    Seems like they are pretty good! "Then there is the Carpigiani K3. Take all the issues with the Taylor C602 and fix them and then you have a K3. It's by far the better machine with tech support that anyone can call into. The only complaint is that most of the parameters are initialized before being translated from German to English." https://old.reddit.com/r/videos/comments/jd2tbq/mcdonalds_ice_cream_machine/g981utj/ https://old.reddit.com/r/videos/comments/jd2tbq/mcdonalds_ic...
    - netsharc 3y ago
      I hope it has a screen somewhere that says "DAS MASCHINE IST NICHT FÜR DER GEFINGERPOKEN UND MITTENGRABEN".
    - jaclaz 3y ago
      Maybe the machines the poster on Reddit saw/dealt with were modified, Carpigiani is Italian[1], so while it is well possible that some settings are not translated from Italian to English, it is unlikely that they were "natively" in German. [1] Specifically from Emilia Romagna, not far from Ravenna, i.e. it is not the case of a bi-lingual Italian/German region such as Trentino Alto Adige.

blamazon 3y ago

Like many corporations nowadays, McDonald's is basically a real estate holding company. The actual franchised businesses that operate on their land are tenants, and as their landlord, McDonald's is, IMO, only incentivized to help them succeed financially insomuch as they desire to collect as much rent from them as possible. This ice cream machine thing is, IMO, an obfuscated method of transferring more value from the ground level businesses to McD's corporate, via the Taylor machine vendor middleman. In other words, paying more rent.

kyleee 3y ago
I think more money is going to Taylor in recurring service revenue. But there were probably kickbacks to McDs when the use of this machine was mandated
- blamazon 3y ago
  Kick-back doesn't have to be a one time thing - my guess (unsubstantiated) is the contracts involved routinely time out, requiring more 'golf-course negotiations.'
  - ghostpepper 3y ago
    That would mean there should be even more evidence laying around, no?
    - blamazon 3y ago
      In theory yes, but in practice, I feel that the transferred value could be ambiguous and obfuscated, even intangible. I would be surprised if McDonald's doesn't have a world class general counsel and legal team that can get very creative. I readily acknowledge this is a cynically conspiratorial take with no evidential basis.
- gruez 3y ago
  >>This ice cream machine thing is, IMO, an obfuscated method of transferring more value from the ground level businesses to McD's corporate, via the Taylor machine vendor middleman. In other words, paying more rent. >But there were probably kickbacks to McDs when the use of this machine was mandated I see this being insinuated since day 1, but after 2 years of lawsuits no document has surfaced during discovery to support this claim. I realize absence of proof isn't proof of absence, but given how much this piece of evidence will help Kytch's case, if not in court of law then in the court of public opinion, I'm inclined to tentatively conclude no such malfeasance has occurred.