4 ms·

> * Somehow finances have to work, which is usually a harsh reality for some. Ex: Hey we can't pay workers $250/hr without raises prices to above what customers

> * Somehow finances have to work, which is usually a harsh reality for some. Ex: Hey we can't pay workers $250/hr without raises prices to above what customers are willing to pay This is one of the most interesting parts of business to me. How do a bunch of people below the "head honcho/top dog" collectively agree "you're right, I don't selfishly look out for myself and think I'm worth $99999999/hr, that person does more than me and their skillset is worth more than mine, I will bow out and not contend to ask for more than them an hour" From there, you get hierarchy You'll have one person paid the most at the top, and it trickles down In worker owned, the people at the bottom... why are they ok with being paid "relatively" the least? Why don't they feel like their work is entitled to as much as those making more than them? How are they ok with not looking out for their own self interest at all times?

popinman322 3y ago
Everyone is different and has different motivations. We don't all think the same way, either. Some workers just want a stable, sane work environment and are willing to compromise on pay for other benefits. These same people are typically willing to let others do more work for more pay because it makes their own lives easier. One possible approach: you could do an exercise where everyone gets $N imaginary dollars and they can bid to not do certain tasks. The bid against each task is then the compensation for that task.
- jimmygrapes 3y ago
  > Everyone is different and has different motivations. We don't all think the same way, either. Spot on! Unfortunately this is also why "everyone is equal" rarely works
  - MrJohz 3y ago
    But nobody is saying that everyone has to be equal. Coops have measurable pay ratios just like everyone else, they just tend not to be as large as non-coops. More important (or harder to find) roles will obviously get paid more. At the end of the day, most people want to get paid, and to get paid, at least in the long term, you need a viable business. So workers tend to make choices that ensure the business is able to survive, because that is more valuable in the long run than lining their own pockets right now and not having a job to go to tomorrow.
oaiey 3y ago
Why? You can lead a place as a dynamic and mother of the company waitress but pay your mission critical and hard to find cooks some dollars more. Why is there a hierarchy? Same supplies in technology: you pay your project manager less despite he is the boss of the developers which earn a lot more. I am literally in a position where I earn like half of what people two levels down of me earn and deserve, nevertheless I lead them and fire them in doubt. I am in a different country of a multi national.
zem 3y ago
why is the person at the top (i assume you mean the person running operations and making business decisions) automatically the person who gets paid the most? that's very hierarchical business thinking, that being the manager makes you the highest status and highest paid worker. i can imagine a worker co-op restaurant in which the chef is the highest status and highest paid employee and someone else runs the business end of things because that's what they're good at.
talldatethrow 3y ago
I worked in car sales for a decade, being as good as #5 in the US for a large brand. One year I made $260k, more than anyone that actually worked above me at the automall including the CPA comptroller and GM (the other brands at the 'automall' had a bad year while mine had a breakout year due to new models). I started a year before cash for clunkers came out. I basically was making $200k a year after learning the ropes for 6 months. The owner that year lost over a million dollars. Not all compensation is based on hierarchy. Commission sales and performance based pay has its advantages.

popinman322 3y ago

Everyone is different and has different motivations. We don't all think the same way, either. Some workers just want a stable, sane work environment and are willing to compromise on pay for other benefits. These same people are typically willing to let others do more work for more pay because it makes their own lives easier. One possible approach: you could do an exercise where everyone gets $N imaginary dollars and they can bid to not do certain tasks. The bid against each task is then the compensation for that task.

jimmygrapes 3y ago
> Everyone is different and has different motivations. We don't all think the same way, either. Spot on! Unfortunately this is also why "everyone is equal" rarely works
- MrJohz 3y ago
  But nobody is saying that everyone has to be equal. Coops have measurable pay ratios just like everyone else, they just tend not to be as large as non-coops. More important (or harder to find) roles will obviously get paid more. At the end of the day, most people want to get paid, and to get paid, at least in the long term, you need a viable business. So workers tend to make choices that ensure the business is able to survive, because that is more valuable in the long run than lining their own pockets right now and not having a job to go to tomorrow.

oaiey 3y ago

Why? You can lead a place as a dynamic and mother of the company waitress but pay your mission critical and hard to find cooks some dollars more. Why is there a hierarchy? Same supplies in technology: you pay your project manager less despite he is the boss of the developers which earn a lot more. I am literally in a position where I earn like half of what people two levels down of me earn and deserve, nevertheless I lead them and fire them in doubt. I am in a different country of a multi national.

zem 3y ago

why is the person at the top (i assume you mean the person running operations and making business decisions) automatically the person who gets paid the most? that's very hierarchical business thinking, that being the manager makes you the highest status and highest paid worker. i can imagine a worker co-op restaurant in which the chef is the highest status and highest paid employee and someone else runs the business end of things because that's what they're good at.

talldatethrow 3y ago

I worked in car sales for a decade, being as good as #5 in the US for a large brand. One year I made $260k, more than anyone that actually worked above me at the automall including the CPA comptroller and GM (the other brands at the 'automall' had a bad year while mine had a breakout year due to new models). I started a year before cash for clunkers came out. I basically was making $200k a year after learning the ropes for 6 months. The owner that year lost over a million dollars. Not all compensation is based on hierarchy. Commission sales and performance based pay has its advantages.