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I know most people here might not like this, but honest question, besides the fact that there are lots of jobs around the Bay Area and LA, why would anyone want

I know most people here might not like this, but honest question, besides the fact that there are lots of jobs around the Bay Area and LA, why would anyone want to settle down in California? The place is almost hostile to having a family or to anyone not in the upper middle class. Housing is ridiculous. Utilities are ridiculous. Political issues are rampant. Homeless and crimes everywhere. Owning a car or anything bigger than a bike is a hassle and full of cost and regulations. Racial and political ideologues are everywhere including in schools and they have tremendous influence. One can lose their entire livelihood if they were found to have "wrongthink" by these ideologues. Correct me if I am wrong on any of those because that is my impression after living in SF for a while. CA is great for vacations or if you have a stable 200-300k salary (except software, no other career can afford this unless you are in very senior levels). Otherwise imo, it isn't worth it to stay there. The big companies seem to agree and are moving out. The moment CA lose its only lure which is jobs, it will be a death spiral.

CameronNemo 3y ago
Racial and political ideologues are everywhere including in schools and they have tremendous influence. One can lose their entire livelihood if they were found to have "wrongthink" by these ideologues. Is there a place on earth where this isn't the case?
Sohcahtoa82 3y ago
I dream of moving to Santa Clarita (not to be confused with Santa Clara) so I can be close to Six Flags Magic Mountain. I'm a huge roller coaster fanatic, but I live in Portland, OR. The nearest park worth going to is Silverwood in Idaho, which is a ~8-hour drive. Alternatively is Six Flags Discovery Kingdom in Vallejo, CA, which is also ~10 hours away. I'd also like to escape Portland's extreme dreary fall/winter seasons of nearly constant overcast clouds and rain, even if it effectively means permanent summer. What's keeping me in Portland? Basically everything you mentioned. Technically, I'm in Beaverton, a suburb just outside of Portland, so I don't have most of the Portland problems which are similar to California problems but on a smaller scale. But also, both me and my wife have all of our close family and friends in Oregon. If we moved to California, we'd be leaving everyone we know behind.
- jjtheblunt 3y ago
  one thought: my dad lived in Hillsboro, shared your boredom with the long overcast and drizzly months, while I lived in San Diego, and later east bay norcal (as they call it), and found that it was EXACTLY as annoyingly monotonous, just the too many sunny days version. I'm just sharing this because you could move to around Vallejo and you'd just get a sign-error on the monotony, and realize it after moving. Just my 2 cents...
- p1mrx 3y ago
  Maps of roller coasters by US state Total: https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/comments/ixctmz/map_of_the_amount_of_roller_coasters_located_in/ https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/comments/ixctmz/map_of_the_... Per capita: https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/comments/ixgjit/since_somebody_asked_for_itamerican_roller/ https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/comments/ixgjit/since_someb...
  - Sohcahtoa82 3y ago
    Oh, believe me, as a roller coaster fanatic, I know where all the good rides are. My second choice for moving would be Sandusky, Ohio, so I could be right next to Cedar Point, as well as being closer to even more parks in that region of the country.
efields 3y ago
> The place is almost hostile to having a family or to anyone not in the upper middle class. See also the other 49 states. > Housing is ridiculous. Utilities are ridiculous. Political issues are rampant. Homeless and crimes everywhere. Owning a car or anything bigger than a bike is a hassle and full of cost and regulations. Racial and political ideologues are everywhere including in schools and they have tremendous influence. One can lose their entire livelihood if they were found to have "wrongthink" by these ideologues. Owning a car in most of the US is a socially-mandated hassle you must impose upon your life to succeed. I'm sitting in a car service lounge typing this, in fact. You can lose your entire livelihood in the US very easily by opting out of car culture, or losing your license, or missing certain payments. Everything else mentioned is increasingly everywhere in the US. One person's ideology is just another person's god-given natural order of course (PaRenTal rIGHTs).
- galaxytachyon 3y ago
  In Houston, owning a car is pretty simple. I pay a registration and insurance online and I am done. Car has problems? There are a hundred car shops around that fix it in a day or two for a fraction of the cost a dealer asks. Gas price is fine. No problem with break in or theft either in the ten years I was in Houston. And maybe because it is Houston, but there is no problem being LGBTQ here or having progressive ideals. The local government is left leaning but the state is right leaning so they kind of balance out imo. I actually saw true diversity and freedom of expression in Houston compared to the SF's version of it where there are certain types of topic everyone has to tiptoe around. In Houston, even truly controversial opinions are still allowed because for better or worse, there are some people in power who share that opinion, no matter if it is far left or right. IMO, that is better but I understand this can be subjective.
  - finite_depth 3y ago
    "There is no problem being LGBTQ here" Yeah, famously no hostile laws against queer people in Texas. https://www.texastribune.org/2023/08/25/texas-transgender-kids-health-care-lawsuit/ https://www.texastribune.org/2023/08/25/texas-transgender-ki...
fairity 3y ago
> besides the fact that there are lots of jobs around the Bay Area and LA, why would anyone want to settle down in California? Weather and proximity to a beautiful coastline.
paxys 3y ago
> Housing is ridiculous There is lots of housing outside of the Bay Area and other expensive cities. > Utilities are ridiculous As in the rest of the country. Climate change and soaring energy costs isn't a California-specific problem. Look at the TX grid for example. > Political issues are rampant What does this even mean? Where in the country doesn't have "political issues"? > Homeless and crimes everywhere Again, there is a lot more to California outside of three square blocks in San Francisco and LA that the media is focused on. > Owning a car or anything bigger than a bike is a hassle and full of cost and regulations. What is the hassle other than the fact that you are paying slightly more? > Racial and political ideologues are everywhere including in schools and they have tremendous influence. One can lose their entire livelihood if they were found to have "wrongthink" by these ideologues. Again, this describes every inch of this country, and is in fact a lot worse in conservative and religion-dominated cities/states. The one thing I agree with is that things are generally expensive, but then you are also getting paid more to make up for it (CA minimum wage is $15.50 for example, and it is even higher in several cities). So overall you have to decide if it makes financial sense for you vs painting a broad generalization. There is no haven for poor people in this country, and California at least has social programs. If you want (1) cheap and (2) conservative, then the Bay Area is not the place for you, and it doesn't need to be. There are plenty of other reasons to move, like weather, social policies, jobs/career progress, access to nature, mountains/beaches/hikes/ski slopes, walkable cities, worker protections, LGBTQ rights, women's rights/healthcare, treatment of minorities, general quality of life.
- galaxytachyon 3y ago
  Before SF, I was in Houston. I would say it is a lot better over there, except for the weather. Housing and utilities are not ridiculous. A good 2000sqft house is 400k. PG&E is less than half CA price. The news shows you the anomaly market prices that nobody pays because everybody has fixed pricing which is about 14-15c/kWh. Homelessness and crime are basically unnoticeable. I can park my car almost anywhere and never worried about break in or theft and no I don't live in any special places. In fact the area I live in is actually in the "less safe" area. But I was there for nearly a decade and never had any issue. SF was the first city I was scared of walking outside alone or leave my car unattended. Also, within Houston, the city kind of lean left but the state government leans right so overall, the political effects balance out. There is no such thing as "no white allowed" playdate in schools or DEI overreach like the ones I saw in SF. There is also no prosecution of LGBTQ people or minority harassment either. It is a very "live and let live" city where if you mind your own business, nobody will interfere. On the other hand, I moved to SF and tried to stay downtown. Could not afford it after a while and felt seriously unsafe with the homelessness issues and moved to Daly City after. Things are still expensive there even when it is the "suburb". Rent is still 2k for tiny apartment. Utilities are still just as expensive. Car is now a necessity because by bus or train it takes double the time and also my work hours are not fixed, so I need to stay late sometimes. And no way in hell I am taking public transit at midnight. It is guaranteed to end in a robbery eventually. A house is completely out of reach. I am in STEM, work for a top company in the field, at a very high skill position, and my salary after tax would never allow me to buy a house here unless I live like a student for the rest of my working life. Meanwhile, if I go back to Houston, I can have a house right now at this exact moment using just the cash I have. That is how much different it is. Accounting for taxes and the cost of living, I am living much poorer here in SF than I was in Houston. And I am sure I am not alone in this experience. It is not a coincidence that lots of people are leaving CA to go to Texas. Even the big companies agreed.
callalex 3y ago
We have stronger worker protections than most states, stronger consumer protections than most states, stronger privacy laws than all other states, better environmental regulations than other states. It is OK to be LGBT here. If I have a small oopsie with my wife, we don’t have to completely change the course of our lives because we don’t let old men hallucinating fairies dictate our medical care. Civics aside, we have so many different biomes close by to each other which is amazing if you enjoy exploring the outdoors.
thebradbain 3y ago
Because it’s beautiful. Where else can you ski and go to the beach on the same day? Or be in hours proximity to not just one, but three world-class national parks within a day-trip from some of the largest and most metropolitan cities in the world? Add on the fact it’s got one of the best climates in the world, no mosquitos, and no humidity… The funny thing, even if jobs left, a large amount of people who live here won’t. The land will just always be inherently desirable. A large contingent of people will always refuse to give that up. And if enough people leave at once such that real estate crashes, you’ll just see people move back here, because they can afford to again. So too with jobs— they go where the people are, not vice versa. Whereas say, Detroit collapsed due to the auto industry leaving and white flight to the suburbs— California is #1 in the tech industry (SF), #1 in entertainment (Los Angeles), #1 in biotech and pharmaceuticals (Orange County / San Diego), #1 in agriculture, #1 in shipping (Los Angeles), #1 in military (San Diego), #2 in energy… This state simply can’t collapse from just one pillar falling. And again, unlike Michigan, there is no coastline in the US that is as near as desirable as California’s to live on. I don’t live here because it’s affordable, or particularly well-run, but because I have family and friends here and I could not imagine living anywhere else.
dmode 3y ago
This is such a ridiculous hyperbole, I am surprised it is the top comment on Hacker News. There are still 40 mn people in California, and people still move here. - Housing is ridiculous -> pay can also be ridiculous. And housing can be cheap once you move out of Bay or Los Angeles - Utilities are ridiculous --> You don't really pay that much because of temperate weather - Political issues are rampant --> Not sure what this means. I mean, political issues are rampant everywhere. Have you seen Florida ? Whole politics is based on around being "anti woke". Or Texas ? Ridiculous stunt (flying migrants, banning abortions). I prefer not to live in a Christian theocracy - Homeless and crimes everywhere --> Do you get your news from Fox ? There is like zero homelessness and very little crime outside of very large cities. Even in SF, once you are out of downtown, there is very little homelessness. In fact, SF has some of the lowest violent crime rates - Own a car and bike is a hassle --> LOL, what ? Is that why every family has multiple cars and bikes ? And is by far the leading EV ownership rates in the US ? - Racial and political ideologues.... --> Again reads like a Fox news headline. Perhaps you prefer the book banning ideologies and "benefits of slavery" being taught elsewhere. My kid goes to a public school here and it is amazing the amount of effort is put in to be inclusive - One can lose entire livelihood.... --> Can't even, insanely ridiculous
- paxys 3y ago
  > I am surprised it is the top comment on Hacker News Sadly not too surprising if you have followed this forum over the last few years. It is still great for certain topics, but for several others the top voted comments are all just the standard talking points pushed to Fox News hosts.
  - galaxytachyon 3y ago
    Am I out of touch? No, it must have been the others who are wrong.
- galaxytachyon 3y ago
  I have lived in Houston and the bay area. Comparing the two, I prefer Houston. Like I said, pay is only ridiculous if you are in software. For the vast majority of other profession, what is ridiculous are the prices and taxes levied on them. The matter with politics might be subjective. But imo, all the stunts and stupid things the "Christian theocracy" are doing do not affect the majority of people living in Texas. The kind of regulations and political stunts in CA on the other hand directly affect the middle class. Affirmative actions and the DEI overreach have more effects on an average person's life than bussing migrants around and banning children's books. One is an inconvenience. The other potentially involves job loss and large changes in life. That is my view. Also, before you jump to conclusion. I am a minority in STEM and I consider myself agnostic. The most extreme examples of the "Christian theocracy" you mentioned only happen rarely and personally I was never affected by any of them even though I should by the type of demographic they are allegedly targeting. In SF though, I am directly affected by the taxes and fees to pay for homelessness and DEI issues while still worried on my way home about crimes and whether my car's windows were smashed or not. And homelessness is still an issue even in the suburb like Brisbane and Daly City.
vikramkr 3y ago
California is way more tolerant of wrong think than elsewhere in the country - local school board elections in SC for example were horrifically toxic and administrators lost their jobs for discussing mask mandates, critical race theory, the existence of LGBT issues, etc. Leaving SC for CA - it's so nice to be somewhere that isn't so caught up in the culture war of the moment. Big cities are also nice - if you move to a small town, you better conform culturally. It's expensive but the economy is so dominant in so many areas it would take a long time to peel away the reasons people move there. There are a lot of pretty awful things about CA, but it has its draw for a reason. Also the weather is insanely nice and the produce is so fresh and the food is good and the cities have all the city things you could want. Unparalleled maker scene, bars and restaurants, art and entertainment. There are things like housing and crime that drive people away, but I'm not sure any other cities do the other stuff so much better that you'd leave for the new city instead of to get away from SF. I'm super partial to NY but even I get that it's not wildly better in some fundamental way.
finite_depth 3y ago
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schmookeeg 3y ago
We tried to leave (Coastal Los Angeles) and failed to find our blue heaven anywhere else. (Almost Cape Town... almost. May yet retire there) We ended up back in the bay area after trying non-Cali for 5 years. For your questions? We don't want kids, we are firmly upper middle class. We bought a house without trouble or sacrifice. We are in an area not in PG&E territory so Utilities are fine. We are apolitical so skip a LOT of noise in news and social media. Homeless and crimes ARE everywhere, not just here? Our two cars are not troublesome to own. We are good at identifying and ignoring ideologues -- and we have not yet been discovered in our wrongthink and sent for livelihood-ruining re-education. (wtf are you even on about with this?) We're lucky. Others struggle, I get it. Sucks. Our austere life choices and preferences favor it here quite strongly. Others, maybe not as much. That's cool. I'm not out rallying a cry against Wichita on some forum they frequent and trying to bend them to my own preferences. That's rude. Sorry it wasn't for you. Doesn't mean it's not for ANYONE.
toomuchtodo 3y ago
They are the fifth largest economy in the world. Family and economics (jobs and markets) are pretty straightforward reasons to locate to or remain in CA. That’s like saying “why would anyone want to live in Germany or the UK?”

CameronNemo 3y ago

Racial and political ideologues are everywhere including in schools and they have tremendous influence. One can lose their entire livelihood if they were found to have "wrongthink" by these ideologues. Is there a place on earth where this isn't the case?

Sohcahtoa82 3y ago

I dream of moving to Santa Clarita (not to be confused with Santa Clara) so I can be close to Six Flags Magic Mountain. I'm a huge roller coaster fanatic, but I live in Portland, OR. The nearest park worth going to is Silverwood in Idaho, which is a ~8-hour drive. Alternatively is Six Flags Discovery Kingdom in Vallejo, CA, which is also ~10 hours away. I'd also like to escape Portland's extreme dreary fall/winter seasons of nearly constant overcast clouds and rain, even if it effectively means permanent summer. What's keeping me in Portland? Basically everything you mentioned. Technically, I'm in Beaverton, a suburb just outside of Portland, so I don't have most of the Portland problems which are similar to California problems but on a smaller scale. But also, both me and my wife have all of our close family and friends in Oregon. If we moved to California, we'd be leaving everyone we know behind.

jjtheblunt 3y ago
one thought: my dad lived in Hillsboro, shared your boredom with the long overcast and drizzly months, while I lived in San Diego, and later east bay norcal (as they call it), and found that it was EXACTLY as annoyingly monotonous, just the too many sunny days version. I'm just sharing this because you could move to around Vallejo and you'd just get a sign-error on the monotony, and realize it after moving. Just my 2 cents...
p1mrx 3y ago
Maps of roller coasters by US state Total: https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/comments/ixctmz/map_of_the_amount_of_roller_coasters_located_in/ https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/comments/ixctmz/map_of_the_... Per capita: https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/comments/ixgjit/since_somebody_asked_for_itamerican_roller/ https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/comments/ixgjit/since_someb...
- Sohcahtoa82 3y ago
  Oh, believe me, as a roller coaster fanatic, I know where all the good rides are. My second choice for moving would be Sandusky, Ohio, so I could be right next to Cedar Point, as well as being closer to even more parks in that region of the country.

efields 3y ago

> The place is almost hostile to having a family or to anyone not in the upper middle class. See also the other 49 states. > Housing is ridiculous. Utilities are ridiculous. Political issues are rampant. Homeless and crimes everywhere. Owning a car or anything bigger than a bike is a hassle and full of cost and regulations. Racial and political ideologues are everywhere including in schools and they have tremendous influence. One can lose their entire livelihood if they were found to have "wrongthink" by these ideologues. Owning a car in most of the US is a socially-mandated hassle you must impose upon your life to succeed. I'm sitting in a car service lounge typing this, in fact. You can lose your entire livelihood in the US very easily by opting out of car culture, or losing your license, or missing certain payments. Everything else mentioned is increasingly everywhere in the US. One person's ideology is just another person's god-given natural order of course (PaRenTal rIGHTs).

galaxytachyon 3y ago
In Houston, owning a car is pretty simple. I pay a registration and insurance online and I am done. Car has problems? There are a hundred car shops around that fix it in a day or two for a fraction of the cost a dealer asks. Gas price is fine. No problem with break in or theft either in the ten years I was in Houston. And maybe because it is Houston, but there is no problem being LGBTQ here or having progressive ideals. The local government is left leaning but the state is right leaning so they kind of balance out imo. I actually saw true diversity and freedom of expression in Houston compared to the SF's version of it where there are certain types of topic everyone has to tiptoe around. In Houston, even truly controversial opinions are still allowed because for better or worse, there are some people in power who share that opinion, no matter if it is far left or right. IMO, that is better but I understand this can be subjective.
- finite_depth 3y ago
  "There is no problem being LGBTQ here" Yeah, famously no hostile laws against queer people in Texas. https://www.texastribune.org/2023/08/25/texas-transgender-kids-health-care-lawsuit/ https://www.texastribune.org/2023/08/25/texas-transgender-ki...

fairity 3y ago

> besides the fact that there are lots of jobs around the Bay Area and LA, why would anyone want to settle down in California? Weather and proximity to a beautiful coastline.

paxys 3y ago

> Housing is ridiculous There is lots of housing outside of the Bay Area and other expensive cities. > Utilities are ridiculous As in the rest of the country. Climate change and soaring energy costs isn't a California-specific problem. Look at the TX grid for example. > Political issues are rampant What does this even mean? Where in the country doesn't have "political issues"? > Homeless and crimes everywhere Again, there is a lot more to California outside of three square blocks in San Francisco and LA that the media is focused on. > Owning a car or anything bigger than a bike is a hassle and full of cost and regulations. What is the hassle other than the fact that you are paying slightly more? > Racial and political ideologues are everywhere including in schools and they have tremendous influence. One can lose their entire livelihood if they were found to have "wrongthink" by these ideologues. Again, this describes every inch of this country, and is in fact a lot worse in conservative and religion-dominated cities/states. The one thing I agree with is that things are generally expensive, but then you are also getting paid more to make up for it (CA minimum wage is $15.50 for example, and it is even higher in several cities). So overall you have to decide if it makes financial sense for you vs painting a broad generalization. There is no haven for poor people in this country, and California at least has social programs. If you want (1) cheap and (2) conservative, then the Bay Area is not the place for you, and it doesn't need to be. There are plenty of other reasons to move, like weather, social policies, jobs/career progress, access to nature, mountains/beaches/hikes/ski slopes, walkable cities, worker protections, LGBTQ rights, women's rights/healthcare, treatment of minorities, general quality of life.

galaxytachyon 3y ago
Before SF, I was in Houston. I would say it is a lot better over there, except for the weather. Housing and utilities are not ridiculous. A good 2000sqft house is 400k. PG&E is less than half CA price. The news shows you the anomaly market prices that nobody pays because everybody has fixed pricing which is about 14-15c/kWh. Homelessness and crime are basically unnoticeable. I can park my car almost anywhere and never worried about break in or theft and no I don't live in any special places. In fact the area I live in is actually in the "less safe" area. But I was there for nearly a decade and never had any issue. SF was the first city I was scared of walking outside alone or leave my car unattended. Also, within Houston, the city kind of lean left but the state government leans right so overall, the political effects balance out. There is no such thing as "no white allowed" playdate in schools or DEI overreach like the ones I saw in SF. There is also no prosecution of LGBTQ people or minority harassment either. It is a very "live and let live" city where if you mind your own business, nobody will interfere. On the other hand, I moved to SF and tried to stay downtown. Could not afford it after a while and felt seriously unsafe with the homelessness issues and moved to Daly City after. Things are still expensive there even when it is the "suburb". Rent is still 2k for tiny apartment. Utilities are still just as expensive. Car is now a necessity because by bus or train it takes double the time and also my work hours are not fixed, so I need to stay late sometimes. And no way in hell I am taking public transit at midnight. It is guaranteed to end in a robbery eventually. A house is completely out of reach. I am in STEM, work for a top company in the field, at a very high skill position, and my salary after tax would never allow me to buy a house here unless I live like a student for the rest of my working life. Meanwhile, if I go back to Houston, I can have a house right now at this exact moment using just the cash I have. That is how much different it is. Accounting for taxes and the cost of living, I am living much poorer here in SF than I was in Houston. And I am sure I am not alone in this experience. It is not a coincidence that lots of people are leaving CA to go to Texas. Even the big companies agreed.

callalex 3y ago

We have stronger worker protections than most states, stronger consumer protections than most states, stronger privacy laws than all other states, better environmental regulations than other states. It is OK to be LGBT here. If I have a small oopsie with my wife, we don’t have to completely change the course of our lives because we don’t let old men hallucinating fairies dictate our medical care. Civics aside, we have so many different biomes close by to each other which is amazing if you enjoy exploring the outdoors.

thebradbain 3y ago

Because it’s beautiful. Where else can you ski and go to the beach on the same day? Or be in hours proximity to not just one, but three world-class national parks within a day-trip from some of the largest and most metropolitan cities in the world? Add on the fact it’s got one of the best climates in the world, no mosquitos, and no humidity… The funny thing, even if jobs left, a large amount of people who live here won’t. The land will just always be inherently desirable. A large contingent of people will always refuse to give that up. And if enough people leave at once such that real estate crashes, you’ll just see people move back here, because they can afford to again. So too with jobs— they go where the people are, not vice versa. Whereas say, Detroit collapsed due to the auto industry leaving and white flight to the suburbs— California is #1 in the tech industry (SF), #1 in entertainment (Los Angeles), #1 in biotech and pharmaceuticals (Orange County / San Diego), #1 in agriculture, #1 in shipping (Los Angeles), #1 in military (San Diego), #2 in energy… This state simply can’t collapse from just one pillar falling. And again, unlike Michigan, there is no coastline in the US that is as near as desirable as California’s to live on. I don’t live here because it’s affordable, or particularly well-run, but because I have family and friends here and I could not imagine living anywhere else.

dmode 3y ago

This is such a ridiculous hyperbole, I am surprised it is the top comment on Hacker News. There are still 40 mn people in California, and people still move here. - Housing is ridiculous -> pay can also be ridiculous. And housing can be cheap once you move out of Bay or Los Angeles - Utilities are ridiculous --> You don't really pay that much because of temperate weather - Political issues are rampant --> Not sure what this means. I mean, political issues are rampant everywhere. Have you seen Florida ? Whole politics is based on around being "anti woke". Or Texas ? Ridiculous stunt (flying migrants, banning abortions). I prefer not to live in a Christian theocracy - Homeless and crimes everywhere --> Do you get your news from Fox ? There is like zero homelessness and very little crime outside of very large cities. Even in SF, once you are out of downtown, there is very little homelessness. In fact, SF has some of the lowest violent crime rates - Own a car and bike is a hassle --> LOL, what ? Is that why every family has multiple cars and bikes ? And is by far the leading EV ownership rates in the US ? - Racial and political ideologues.... --> Again reads like a Fox news headline. Perhaps you prefer the book banning ideologies and "benefits of slavery" being taught elsewhere. My kid goes to a public school here and it is amazing the amount of effort is put in to be inclusive - One can lose entire livelihood.... --> Can't even, insanely ridiculous

paxys 3y ago
> I am surprised it is the top comment on Hacker News Sadly not too surprising if you have followed this forum over the last few years. It is still great for certain topics, but for several others the top voted comments are all just the standard talking points pushed to Fox News hosts.
- galaxytachyon 3y ago
  Am I out of touch? No, it must have been the others who are wrong.
galaxytachyon 3y ago
I have lived in Houston and the bay area. Comparing the two, I prefer Houston. Like I said, pay is only ridiculous if you are in software. For the vast majority of other profession, what is ridiculous are the prices and taxes levied on them. The matter with politics might be subjective. But imo, all the stunts and stupid things the "Christian theocracy" are doing do not affect the majority of people living in Texas. The kind of regulations and political stunts in CA on the other hand directly affect the middle class. Affirmative actions and the DEI overreach have more effects on an average person's life than bussing migrants around and banning children's books. One is an inconvenience. The other potentially involves job loss and large changes in life. That is my view. Also, before you jump to conclusion. I am a minority in STEM and I consider myself agnostic. The most extreme examples of the "Christian theocracy" you mentioned only happen rarely and personally I was never affected by any of them even though I should by the type of demographic they are allegedly targeting. In SF though, I am directly affected by the taxes and fees to pay for homelessness and DEI issues while still worried on my way home about crimes and whether my car's windows were smashed or not. And homelessness is still an issue even in the suburb like Brisbane and Daly City.

vikramkr 3y ago

California is way more tolerant of wrong think than elsewhere in the country - local school board elections in SC for example were horrifically toxic and administrators lost their jobs for discussing mask mandates, critical race theory, the existence of LGBT issues, etc. Leaving SC for CA - it's so nice to be somewhere that isn't so caught up in the culture war of the moment. Big cities are also nice - if you move to a small town, you better conform culturally. It's expensive but the economy is so dominant in so many areas it would take a long time to peel away the reasons people move there. There are a lot of pretty awful things about CA, but it has its draw for a reason. Also the weather is insanely nice and the produce is so fresh and the food is good and the cities have all the city things you could want. Unparalleled maker scene, bars and restaurants, art and entertainment. There are things like housing and crime that drive people away, but I'm not sure any other cities do the other stuff so much better that you'd leave for the new city instead of to get away from SF. I'm super partial to NY but even I get that it's not wildly better in some fundamental way.

finite_depth 3y ago

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schmookeeg 3y ago

We tried to leave (Coastal Los Angeles) and failed to find our blue heaven anywhere else. (Almost Cape Town... almost. May yet retire there) We ended up back in the bay area after trying non-Cali for 5 years. For your questions? We don't want kids, we are firmly upper middle class. We bought a house without trouble or sacrifice. We are in an area not in PG&E territory so Utilities are fine. We are apolitical so skip a LOT of noise in news and social media. Homeless and crimes ARE everywhere, not just here? Our two cars are not troublesome to own. We are good at identifying and ignoring ideologues -- and we have not yet been discovered in our wrongthink and sent for livelihood-ruining re-education. (wtf are you even on about with this?) We're lucky. Others struggle, I get it. Sucks. Our austere life choices and preferences favor it here quite strongly. Others, maybe not as much. That's cool. I'm not out rallying a cry against Wichita on some forum they frequent and trying to bend them to my own preferences. That's rude. Sorry it wasn't for you. Doesn't mean it's not for ANYONE.

toomuchtodo 3y ago

They are the fifth largest economy in the world. Family and economics (jobs and markets) are pretty straightforward reasons to locate to or remain in CA. That’s like saying “why would anyone want to live in Germany or the UK?”