3 ms·

Maybe that prospect is good enough for you. For all of it, you do not care about any consequences, as you did not care about the fate of ethnic Serbs in Kosovo.

Maybe that prospect is good enough for you. For all of it, you do not care about any consequences, as you did not care about the fate of ethnic Serbs in Kosovo. Russians understand what's going on here and are motivated to not let that happen. At the moment they are successful.

jacquesm 3y ago
> Russians understand what's going on here That's just funny. Seriously, I can't tell if you're trolling or serious but on the off chance that you are serious: you're so misinformed it is tragic, at the same time you are apparently able to fix that and refuse to do so. Which makes me wonder why. I have enough contacts in former USSR countries and inside Russia itself to know that this sentiment is prevalent, wilful misunderstanding as some kind of defense mechanism. But in the modern day with ample access to information you really have no excuse. Serbia will have to come to terms with the degree to which Russia has been using them at some point. This probably won't happen until Russia itself has gone through an enlightenment and shaken of the current crop of mobsters. I'm not holding my breath for that one.
- thriftwy 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - jacquesm 3y ago
    [flagged]
    - thriftwy 3y ago
      [flagged]
      - jacquesm 3y ago
        [flagged]
        thriftwy 3y ago
        [flagged]
        jacquesm 3y ago
        [flagged]
        thriftwy 3y ago
        [flagged]
  - Ancapistani 3y ago
    With the exception of the language issue, pretty much all of the above describes the US as well. The South and Midwest are far more cohesive with regard to each other than the coastal cities and Pacific Northwest, and vice versa. Every 4-8 years we tend to "overthrow" the preferred Presidential candidate of one of those two factions - as flawed as they are - through a democratic process. One of those factions prefers stronger social programs while the other prefers weaker. Note that I explicitly don't intend for this comment to become about the US civil war, and will not respond to any comments about the historical or social conditions there. For that matter, it also describes Canada to a large extent; there is a large, geographically concentrated faction of Francophones and a similarly large, geographically concentrated faction of Anglophones. They have significantly divergent histories, social norms, and so on. In fact... every large country with which I'm familiar that does not share a single common history and culture has these issues. They all seem to come to a workable system for integrating their factions into a single political system absent outside force. I see no reason Ukraine shouldn't be able to do that same, given a few decades to get there.
    - thriftwy 3y ago
      > we tend to "overthrow" the preferred Presidential candidate of one of those two factions through a democratic process Well the Ukrainians did that by gathering a large crowd and dislodging a President they don't like. The USA is not there yet, but the latest events around Trump point that it is an option to contemplate in the future. > describes Canada to a large extent; there is a large, geographically concentrated faction of Francophones and a similarly large, geographically concentrated faction of Anglophones. Imagine Canada passing laws that the only language of education and government services should be French. Because that's basically what happened. It all started when the aforementioned large crowd overthrew the Eastern-elected president and then cancelled the law giving the East an option to use their mother's tongue (Russian). And then Vancouver saying Au Revoir and joining the US. More specifically, Victoria and Vancouver Island with its naval bases joining the US outright, and Vancouver city becoming a "Republic of Vancouver" besieged by Canadian army. Then Canada spends a decade explaining everybody (in French) that it's a US proxy led by some rednecks who moved in from Seattle. Not all of them are even Canadian! Whereas people in Toronto begrudgingly begin learning French, the ones who want to show loyalty to the state do so by switching to Frenglish. New textbooks issued by Quebec intellectual circles depict the "many wars" that Canada has fought against the USA and England all the times. Some of those are technically correct. The wars where Canada has fought on the side of England or USA are skipped. 24 of August becoming the main pompious state military holiday.
  - tim333 3y ago
    >Why do you think anybody would want to be a citizen of Ukraine? I gather the occupiers are now refusing insulin to diabetics unless they take Russian citizenship. If they have to resort to such death threats then maybe some people do want to remain Ukrainian?
  - dang 3y ago
    Please don't take HN threads further into this kind of flamewar. It doesn't lead anywhere good. Also, please don't cross into personal attack or nationalistic putdowns. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- dang 3y ago
  Please don't take HN threads further into this kind of flamewar. It doesn't lead anywhere good. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

jacquesm 3y ago

> Russians understand what's going on here That's just funny. Seriously, I can't tell if you're trolling or serious but on the off chance that you are serious: you're so misinformed it is tragic, at the same time you are apparently able to fix that and refuse to do so. Which makes me wonder why. I have enough contacts in former USSR countries and inside Russia itself to know that this sentiment is prevalent, wilful misunderstanding as some kind of defense mechanism. But in the modern day with ample access to information you really have no excuse. Serbia will have to come to terms with the degree to which Russia has been using them at some point. This probably won't happen until Russia itself has gone through an enlightenment and shaken of the current crop of mobsters. I'm not holding my breath for that one.

thriftwy 3y ago
[flagged]
- jacquesm 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - thriftwy 3y ago
    [flagged]
    - jacquesm 3y ago
      [flagged]
      - thriftwy 3y ago
        [flagged]
        jacquesm 3y ago
        [flagged]
        thriftwy 3y ago
        [flagged]
- Ancapistani 3y ago
  With the exception of the language issue, pretty much all of the above describes the US as well. The South and Midwest are far more cohesive with regard to each other than the coastal cities and Pacific Northwest, and vice versa. Every 4-8 years we tend to "overthrow" the preferred Presidential candidate of one of those two factions - as flawed as they are - through a democratic process. One of those factions prefers stronger social programs while the other prefers weaker. Note that I explicitly don't intend for this comment to become about the US civil war, and will not respond to any comments about the historical or social conditions there. For that matter, it also describes Canada to a large extent; there is a large, geographically concentrated faction of Francophones and a similarly large, geographically concentrated faction of Anglophones. They have significantly divergent histories, social norms, and so on. In fact... every large country with which I'm familiar that does not share a single common history and culture has these issues. They all seem to come to a workable system for integrating their factions into a single political system absent outside force. I see no reason Ukraine shouldn't be able to do that same, given a few decades to get there.
  - thriftwy 3y ago
    > we tend to "overthrow" the preferred Presidential candidate of one of those two factions through a democratic process Well the Ukrainians did that by gathering a large crowd and dislodging a President they don't like. The USA is not there yet, but the latest events around Trump point that it is an option to contemplate in the future. > describes Canada to a large extent; there is a large, geographically concentrated faction of Francophones and a similarly large, geographically concentrated faction of Anglophones. Imagine Canada passing laws that the only language of education and government services should be French. Because that's basically what happened. It all started when the aforementioned large crowd overthrew the Eastern-elected president and then cancelled the law giving the East an option to use their mother's tongue (Russian). And then Vancouver saying Au Revoir and joining the US. More specifically, Victoria and Vancouver Island with its naval bases joining the US outright, and Vancouver city becoming a "Republic of Vancouver" besieged by Canadian army. Then Canada spends a decade explaining everybody (in French) that it's a US proxy led by some rednecks who moved in from Seattle. Not all of them are even Canadian! Whereas people in Toronto begrudgingly begin learning French, the ones who want to show loyalty to the state do so by switching to Frenglish. New textbooks issued by Quebec intellectual circles depict the "many wars" that Canada has fought against the USA and England all the times. Some of those are technically correct. The wars where Canada has fought on the side of England or USA are skipped. 24 of August becoming the main pompious state military holiday.
- tim333 3y ago
  >Why do you think anybody would want to be a citizen of Ukraine? I gather the occupiers are now refusing insulin to diabetics unless they take Russian citizenship. If they have to resort to such death threats then maybe some people do want to remain Ukrainian?
- dang 3y ago
  Please don't take HN threads further into this kind of flamewar. It doesn't lead anywhere good. Also, please don't cross into personal attack or nationalistic putdowns. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
dang 3y ago
Please don't take HN threads further into this kind of flamewar. It doesn't lead anywhere good. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html