3 ms·

It's possible to be sex positive without being positive on prostitution or porn.

johnnyanmac 3y ago
prostitution, maybe. But porn? This just sounds like "Sex is good, but don't show it to anyone but people you care about". "Porn" as itself is such a general term that it can really mean anything involving exposed genitals. Either way, I feel "sex positive" means being able to respect differences. So it feels weird to call oneself that but also feel that consenting adults cannot exchange money to have sex, even if you never personally want to deal with that.
- alienicecream 3y ago
  > This just sounds like "Sex is good, but don't show it to anyone but people you care about". Yeah, that's "just" the way it's been for most societies in history. > Either way, I feel "sex positive" means being able to respect differences. "sex positive" actually means "pro-prostitution, pro-porn, anti-tradition and anti traditional morality", couched in terms that try to cast a better light on it and to cast people who object to it as joyless prudes. It's a political term.
  - smcin 3y ago
    > "sex positive" actually means "pro-prostitution, pro-porn, anti-tradition and anti traditional morality", couched in terms that try to cast a better light on it and to cast people who object to it as joyless prudes. It's a political term. No it isn't inherently either politically loaded or a euphemism or proxy for any particular platform, no more than 'liberal', 'conservative', 'libertarian', 'family', 'hard-working'. It merely means regarding sex and sexual expression as good and healthy. But there is no shortage of groups who want to coopt it to their political views, just like the other labels mentioned. Defining a term by not affirmatively defining what it means, but in terms of which policy platforms or bag a group opposes, is a pretty clear sign when it's being hijacked or coopted by an interest group. > > This just sounds like "Sex is good, but don't show it to anyone but people you care about". > Yeah, that's "just" the way it's been for most societies in history. Yes, and that only means that technology did not exist until now to simultaneously handle micropayments, security, anonymity, customer acquisition, billing, subscriptions. We could say the exact same thing about most SaaS business models. The thrust of your comment is "What longer-term implications do current evolusions in modes of male-female interaction, online app-based dating, online porn, the monetization of male attention, etc. have for society, sexuality, psychology, morality, relationships, marriage etc.", which is very much an active discussion. Chris Williamson ('Modern Wisdom' [0]) and Dr Alok Kanojia ('HealthyGamerGG' [1]) are two excellent podcasters who interview a range of experts covering this and other areas regularly. Sample them and tell us what you think. Akin to what you mention, another historical relationship trend that was just the way it's been for most societies in history for thousands of years, but is currently changing, is the increase in voluntary childlessness. Clearly there are a lot of enormous trends changing, with major societal implications. As you allude to, there isn't much neutral, fact-based research or discourse on these trends. And the next one will be when AI displaces humans in online sex work; humans using AIs (Replika, et al) as boyfriends/girlfriends. [0]: https://www.youtube.com/@ChrisWillx https://www.youtube.com/@ChrisWillx [1]: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClHVl2N3jPEbkNJVx-ItQIQ https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClHVl2N3jPEbkNJVx-ItQIQ
  - johnnyanmac 3y ago
    >for most societies in history. western ones, yes. And all the territories the west took over. >It's a political term In the same way anything slightly controversial is political, sure. No more political than "anti traditional morality", as if that's such a term to inspire awe.
    - alienicecream 3y ago
      > western ones, yes. And all the territories the west took over. Which moral system is better than the Christian one? > In the same way anything slightly controversial is political, sure. Is that what making up euphemisms to redirect and confuse the public is?
      - johnnyanmac 3y ago
        >Which moral system is better than the Christian one I can't really say. All I can say is that the Christian moral system didn't simply win over other societies through its moral value alone >Is that what making up euphemisms to redirect and confuse the public is? I guess you can spin any kind of PR that way, sure. The Civil Rights movement, the multiple sexual awakenings, the KKK, Christianity, and Super Mario Bros. All make up some kind of PR for some purpose. (and no I hope you don't read too much into that. I hope using Mario and the KKK in the same sentence clues you into this being how general of terms we're speaking).

prostitution, maybe. But porn? This just sounds like "Sex is good, but don't show it to anyone but people you care about". "Porn" as itself is such a general term that it can really mean anything involving exposed genitals. Either way, I feel "sex positive" means being able to respect differences. So it feels weird to call oneself that but also feel that consenting adults cannot exchange money to have sex, even if you never personally want to deal with that.

alienicecream 3y ago
> This just sounds like "Sex is good, but don't show it to anyone but people you care about". Yeah, that's "just" the way it's been for most societies in history. > Either way, I feel "sex positive" means being able to respect differences. "sex positive" actually means "pro-prostitution, pro-porn, anti-tradition and anti traditional morality", couched in terms that try to cast a better light on it and to cast people who object to it as joyless prudes. It's a political term.
- smcin 3y ago
  > "sex positive" actually means "pro-prostitution, pro-porn, anti-tradition and anti traditional morality", couched in terms that try to cast a better light on it and to cast people who object to it as joyless prudes. It's a political term. No it isn't inherently either politically loaded or a euphemism or proxy for any particular platform, no more than 'liberal', 'conservative', 'libertarian', 'family', 'hard-working'. It merely means regarding sex and sexual expression as good and healthy. But there is no shortage of groups who want to coopt it to their political views, just like the other labels mentioned. Defining a term by not affirmatively defining what it means, but in terms of which policy platforms or bag a group opposes, is a pretty clear sign when it's being hijacked or coopted by an interest group. > > This just sounds like "Sex is good, but don't show it to anyone but people you care about". > Yeah, that's "just" the way it's been for most societies in history. Yes, and that only means that technology did not exist until now to simultaneously handle micropayments, security, anonymity, customer acquisition, billing, subscriptions. We could say the exact same thing about most SaaS business models. The thrust of your comment is "What longer-term implications do current evolusions in modes of male-female interaction, online app-based dating, online porn, the monetization of male attention, etc. have for society, sexuality, psychology, morality, relationships, marriage etc.", which is very much an active discussion. Chris Williamson ('Modern Wisdom' [0]) and Dr Alok Kanojia ('HealthyGamerGG' [1]) are two excellent podcasters who interview a range of experts covering this and other areas regularly. Sample them and tell us what you think. Akin to what you mention, another historical relationship trend that was just the way it's been for most societies in history for thousands of years, but is currently changing, is the increase in voluntary childlessness. Clearly there are a lot of enormous trends changing, with major societal implications. As you allude to, there isn't much neutral, fact-based research or discourse on these trends. And the next one will be when AI displaces humans in online sex work; humans using AIs (Replika, et al) as boyfriends/girlfriends. [0]: https://www.youtube.com/@ChrisWillx https://www.youtube.com/@ChrisWillx [1]: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClHVl2N3jPEbkNJVx-ItQIQ https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClHVl2N3jPEbkNJVx-ItQIQ
- johnnyanmac 3y ago
  >for most societies in history. western ones, yes. And all the territories the west took over. >It's a political term In the same way anything slightly controversial is political, sure. No more political than "anti traditional morality", as if that's such a term to inspire awe.
  - alienicecream 3y ago
    > western ones, yes. And all the territories the west took over. Which moral system is better than the Christian one? > In the same way anything slightly controversial is political, sure. Is that what making up euphemisms to redirect and confuse the public is?
    - johnnyanmac 3y ago
      >Which moral system is better than the Christian one I can't really say. All I can say is that the Christian moral system didn't simply win over other societies through its moral value alone >Is that what making up euphemisms to redirect and confuse the public is? I guess you can spin any kind of PR that way, sure. The Civil Rights movement, the multiple sexual awakenings, the KKK, Christianity, and Super Mario Bros. All make up some kind of PR for some purpose. (and no I hope you don't read too much into that. I hope using Mario and the KKK in the same sentence clues you into this being how general of terms we're speaking).