3 ms·

FAA investigation into pilots hiding major health issues. Most are still flying

13 points by xrayarx 3y ago

xrayarx 3y ago
https://archive.md/yKcyk https://archive.md/yKcyk
nocoiner 3y ago
I have a tremendous amount of sympathy for pilots who are forced to neglect their mental health because ordinary treatment that is well within the fairway for the vast majority of Americans can get them grounded. I don’t have a whole lot of sympathy for people overstating their benefits applications to squeeze as many dollars out of taxpayers while representing that they meet the medical criteria to fly a plane.
- halJordan 3y ago
  I don't disagree with you on any point. I will say that the intelligence community seems to be a bit further along the curve where there's been this acceptance that simply getting the same treatment accessible to the general public doesnt destroy your worth as a person. But you get into situations where something happens and Johhny Q Public finds out and the facebook groups & the NYTs all go crazy that how dare they allow this depressed person to participate. It's a hard nut to crack
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
- killingtime74 3y ago
  The harsh consequences can be justified if you consider one of the leading theories on why MH370 was lost (239 people) is suicide? We shouldn't only consider the careers of pilots but also their potential victims. The current rule seems reasonable to me. It just needs to be better enforced. Erring on being too "safe" may lead to some pilots losing their jobs who might not need to, being too lenient can lead to many lives lost in the air and on the ground. Also consider, if other countries or the European union has these same rules, the FAA relaxing them may prevent American pilots from flying there. These flying rights are subject to negotiated treaties that may prevent rule changes.
  - nocoiner 3y ago
    Respectfully, I think there are important cultural differentiators where - to my mind at least - I can’t think of a single American commercial pilot who committed suicide and deliberately took the passengers with him. Whereas half a dozen Incidents of that immediately spring to mind from countries with markedly different aviation cultures. How many pilots have marital difficulties or temporary chemical depression, but can’t seek help for these incredibly ordinary conditions without putting their livelihoods at risk? There’s a big spread between some troubles at home or feeling down in the dumps, and being prepared to off yourself and take a couple hundred innocents with you on your way to hell. The medical evaluation regime should recognize this rather than applying such a blunt instrument to a nuanced, complex issue.
    - killingtime74 3y ago
      (also respectfully, sometimes hard to convey by text) I think they do already consider the cases individually. They don't have a blanket ban I don't think if you're obtaining treatment. From article: "Pilots who have been diagnosed with depression, anxiety or other mental health conditions are not automatically prohibited from flying. But the FAA requires them to be closely monitored because their conditions and medications can affect their ability to safely handle an aircraft."
      - nocoiner 3y ago
        Thank you - respectful tone taken, and I hope it was similarly received. I have only the most tangential experience with this world, but I feel like I have fairly good reason to believe that the conditions that are supposedly “not automatic” disqualifications are, in practice, very difficult for the pilot to prove that he or she is not a danger to himself or others. And at every step, risk averse doctors, managers and bureaucrats are limited in their incentive to clear a pilot to fly after he or she has admitted a mental struggle.
      - Blackthorn 3y ago
        You might be unfamiliar with how that monitoring works. It is not a blanket ban but it is close. If you have that diagnosis and are taking medication for it, you are prohibited from flying for the next year (pretty bad for having an income) and out several thousand in tests while your case works its way through an exceedingly slow system. You're also limited to exactly one of four medications, and if it ever changes you get to go through that process again. Is it any wonder people conceal their issues or don't bother getting treatment when that's how it goes?
Blackthorn 3y ago
> Pilots must request waivers from the FAA for a number of medical conditions, including mental illness, some cardiac issues, and substance abuse. But the wait for those waivers can take months in the FAA’s understaffed medical certification system, one reason pilots say they limit what they report. Months? Hah, that's rich. You'll be waiting at least a year. And out several thousand dollars from all the tests. And don't forget you have to see a very tiny list of FAA approved examiners and psychiatrists. Then you get to go through the process again and again for the rest of your career. Oh yeah, and if your medication ever changes, you get to start the whole thing over.

13 points by xrayarx 3y ago

https://archive.md/yKcyk https://archive.md/yKcyk

I have a tremendous amount of sympathy for pilots who are forced to neglect their mental health because ordinary treatment that is well within the fairway for the vast majority of Americans can get them grounded. I don’t have a whole lot of sympathy for people overstating their benefits applications to squeeze as many dollars out of taxpayers while representing that they meet the medical criteria to fly a plane.

halJordan 3y ago
I don't disagree with you on any point. I will say that the intelligence community seems to be a bit further along the curve where there's been this acceptance that simply getting the same treatment accessible to the general public doesnt destroy your worth as a person. But you get into situations where something happens and Johhny Q Public finds out and the facebook groups & the NYTs all go crazy that how dare they allow this depressed person to participate. It's a hard nut to crack
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
killingtime74 3y ago
The harsh consequences can be justified if you consider one of the leading theories on why MH370 was lost (239 people) is suicide? We shouldn't only consider the careers of pilots but also their potential victims. The current rule seems reasonable to me. It just needs to be better enforced. Erring on being too "safe" may lead to some pilots losing their jobs who might not need to, being too lenient can lead to many lives lost in the air and on the ground. Also consider, if other countries or the European union has these same rules, the FAA relaxing them may prevent American pilots from flying there. These flying rights are subject to negotiated treaties that may prevent rule changes.
- nocoiner 3y ago
  Respectfully, I think there are important cultural differentiators where - to my mind at least - I can’t think of a single American commercial pilot who committed suicide and deliberately took the passengers with him. Whereas half a dozen Incidents of that immediately spring to mind from countries with markedly different aviation cultures. How many pilots have marital difficulties or temporary chemical depression, but can’t seek help for these incredibly ordinary conditions without putting their livelihoods at risk? There’s a big spread between some troubles at home or feeling down in the dumps, and being prepared to off yourself and take a couple hundred innocents with you on your way to hell. The medical evaluation regime should recognize this rather than applying such a blunt instrument to a nuanced, complex issue.
  - killingtime74 3y ago
    (also respectfully, sometimes hard to convey by text) I think they do already consider the cases individually. They don't have a blanket ban I don't think if you're obtaining treatment. From article: "Pilots who have been diagnosed with depression, anxiety or other mental health conditions are not automatically prohibited from flying. But the FAA requires them to be closely monitored because their conditions and medications can affect their ability to safely handle an aircraft."
    - nocoiner 3y ago
      Thank you - respectful tone taken, and I hope it was similarly received. I have only the most tangential experience with this world, but I feel like I have fairly good reason to believe that the conditions that are supposedly “not automatic” disqualifications are, in practice, very difficult for the pilot to prove that he or she is not a danger to himself or others. And at every step, risk averse doctors, managers and bureaucrats are limited in their incentive to clear a pilot to fly after he or she has admitted a mental struggle.
    - Blackthorn 3y ago
      You might be unfamiliar with how that monitoring works. It is not a blanket ban but it is close. If you have that diagnosis and are taking medication for it, you are prohibited from flying for the next year (pretty bad for having an income) and out several thousand in tests while your case works its way through an exceedingly slow system. You're also limited to exactly one of four medications, and if it ever changes you get to go through that process again. Is it any wonder people conceal their issues or don't bother getting treatment when that's how it goes?

Blackthorn 3y ago

> Pilots must request waivers from the FAA for a number of medical conditions, including mental illness, some cardiac issues, and substance abuse. But the wait for those waivers can take months in the FAA’s understaffed medical certification system, one reason pilots say they limit what they report. Months? Hah, that's rich. You'll be waiting at least a year. And out several thousand dollars from all the tests. And don't forget you have to see a very tiny list of FAA approved examiners and psychiatrists. Then you get to go through the process again and again for the rest of your career. Oh yeah, and if your medication ever changes, you get to start the whole thing over.