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> The fact that a single car can even cause this much harm is a sign of a much larger problem: car centric transportation is NOT scalable. This is an interest
by NiloCK 3y ago
> The fact that a single car can even cause this much harm is a sign of a much larger problem: car centric transportation is NOT scalable.
This is an interesting to me. From the perspective of an internet builder, systems vulnerable to shutdown from individual bad actors are obviously insecure and "not scalable". But too much time in this environment can make us forget that the actual world is about a zillion times less hostile than the internet.
As an educator, I worked with a computer security savvy 13 year old who knew my software background and would occasionally disclose vulnerabilities in the district's systems to me. He was incredulous that the network could be so insecure.
I asked about the security systems governing walking around in the hallway - was there any physical impediment preventing one person from punching, kicking, throwing a rock at another? Of course not - the security is socially constructed. Norms, consequences, etc, that on balance seemed to work out pretty effectively. I tried to make a case that security inside a local network of the size and scope of our school board was also ~90% social construction, but the student really struggled with it. There was a strong belief that because it was computers, you were expected to exploit it if it were vulnerable.
First paragraph is about the IT security mindset bleeding into real life, third is about the IT adversarial mindset corrupting our disposition toward technical equipment generally.
Given how immersed current generations are / have been in the adversarial landscape of the web, should we expect an uptick in the level of generalized adversarialism? Will xyst's (and my student's) assessments of these systems become true? Have they already and I'm just a knob?
- psunavy03 3y agoWe're seeing a lot of this in modern society. Social media, guns, politics . . . lots of areas where individual bad actors are overturning "social construction," norms, and trust because they can. Not realizing that a lot of those norms they're pissing all over are vital to having any kind of a society worth living in, which is why seeing them brazenly violated freaks a lot of people TF out. I don't want to live in the ultimate low-trust society because it seems it'd suck for any number of crappy reasons.
- lawrenceyan 3y agoWhy not have systems be as resilient and robust as possible though? For example, with the implementation of crypto, now you can massively lower trust necessary for finance to function. That doesn't mean we purposely try to lower trust. But in the rare event it happens, I feel like it's a good safeguard. Strong foundations in many ways can often enable greater trust too I think.
- zirgs 3y agoWhy are you talking about cryptocurrency as if it was a new technology? It's 15 years old now and it's already pretty clear that it's not very useful for ordinary people.
- sdeframond 3y ago> Why not have systems be as resilient and robust as possible though? Because walking around wearing medieval armors to protect from strangers randomly "punching, kicking, throwing a rock at another" would be so annoying.
- brightlancer 3y ago> Given how immersed current generations are / have been in the adversarial landscape of the web, should we expect an uptick in the level of generalized adversarialism? I'm really interested by this question. My initial thought is that most teens and young adults (like previous generations) aren't savvy about computer security and Student XYZ is the exception rather than the norm. IME, the IRL adversarialism is driven by political/ religious fanaticism rather than a hacker mentality -- they're not tech savvy, they're just determined. That said, the reality is often less important than the perception of reality, particularly _fear_. Businesses and government are reacting to fears which are outsized to the reality, like Terrorism and School Shootings. They're adopting an adversarial mindset as defenders, even in the absence of an uptick in generalized adversarialism.