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Canada has an immigration system that prioritizes educated people who speak their languages. It is a much saner model.

by sgc 3y ago

patmorgan23 3y ago
Proportionally they also take in 10x as many permanent residents each year. They also don't have per country limits.
Terr_ 3y ago
I'd interject here that America has no official national language, and I think it's prudent to keep it that way. In other words, language requirements are not something we should copy from Canadian immigration policy.
- midoridensha 3y ago
  If you can't communicate effectively in one of your host country's main languages, you're not going to be able to support yourself and survive.
  - koshergweilo 3y ago
    That's just not true. Ever been to San Diego? Little Saigon? Chinatown?
    - midoridensha 3y ago
      Right, that's called "ghettoization". It's not really a good recipe for a safe, prosperous nation. You really think things will work out great if you bring in millions of people and all they can do is work as exploited workers in restaurants in one little part of a city? I guess it worked "ok" for America historically because America abused and exploited so many immigrants for so long (go read "The Jungle"), but I don't think that's really something to emulate.
      - Terr_ 3y ago
        > Right, [San Diego / Little Saigon / Chinatown is] called "ghettoization". Just because a geographic concentration originated from forced-segregation policies over a century ago does not automatically mean those bad policies and pejorative status continues today. > It's not really a good recipe for a safe, prosperous nation. [...] exploited so many immigrants Hold up, I think the goalposts are moving a bit here: Earlier you said it was about "supporting themselves" economically. However now it sounds like no amount of economic-self-sufficiency is enough--you're saying those people ought to be blocked/deported unless they can satisfy some ill-defined requirement about where they live and who they socialize with. > bring in millions of people and all they can do is work as exploited workers in restaurants I am doubtful that millions of people who *checks comment-thread* have doctorate degrees and PhDs will be arriving to work for the rest of their lives in restaurants. If they do... well, then they're probably choosing it to escape something crappy enough that we should be letting them in for humanitarian reasons anyway.
    - Terr_ 3y ago
      Also: 1. If being unable to support themselves is the concern, why not make that the actual requirement to stay... Versus of an indirect and error-prone language requirement set by what are probably a bunch of old white monolingual men in Washington, DC? 2. Automatic translation tools have advanced by leaps and bounds over the last few decades.
      - midoridensha 3y ago
        >If being unable to support themselves is the concern, why not make that the actual requirement to stay... That's a good idea. That's how it is here in Japan: knowing the language is good, and gets you some points on your visa, but it's not a requirement. If you have a high-paying job offer from a sponsoring company, and a good educational and professional background (or other factors, like if you're in academia), then that's good too. They figure you'll learn the language on your own in that case. If you have no education and no way to support yourself, and can't communicate with anyone, why would they want you? Unless it's to exploit you. I don't think we should be promoting exploitation. >Versus of an indirect and error-prone language requirement set by what are probably a bunch of old white monolingual men in Washington, DC? US doesn't have a language requirement. We're talking about Canada, so you mean a bunch of white bilingual (English/French) people in Ottawa.
  - iancmceachern 3y ago
    Have you even traveled? There are large pockets of all kinds of folks all kinds of places. There is even a city in Mexico with a huge Chinese population. Americans travel all over expecting to just use English and get by (myself included). You can absolutely do so, I've known many, Americans in Paris, Chinese in Mexico, French in America, on and on
tutorialmanager 3y ago
The US prioritises an ability to swim through a river, climb a small fence, and/or trudge across some desert.
- Clent 3y ago
  Most immigrants do not arrive via the southern border.
  - fakedang 3y ago
    The prioritized ones seem to.
- Ekaros 3y ago
  It started with surviving a cruise over ocean... So I don't think that is much different in that sense.
midoridensha 3y ago
It's much the same in Japan, though education, work experience, and salary count for more than the language.

Canada has an immigration system that prioritizes educated people who speak their languages. It is a much saner model.

by sgc 3y ago

Canada has an immigration system that prioritizes educated people who speak their languages. It is a much saner model.

patmorgan23 3y ago

Proportionally they also take in 10x as many permanent residents each year. They also don't have per country limits.

Terr_ 3y ago

I'd interject here that America has no official national language, and I think it's prudent to keep it that way. In other words, language requirements are not something we should copy from Canadian immigration policy.

midoridensha 3y ago
If you can't communicate effectively in one of your host country's main languages, you're not going to be able to support yourself and survive.
- koshergweilo 3y ago
  That's just not true. Ever been to San Diego? Little Saigon? Chinatown?
  - midoridensha 3y ago
    Right, that's called "ghettoization". It's not really a good recipe for a safe, prosperous nation. You really think things will work out great if you bring in millions of people and all they can do is work as exploited workers in restaurants in one little part of a city? I guess it worked "ok" for America historically because America abused and exploited so many immigrants for so long (go read "The Jungle"), but I don't think that's really something to emulate.
    - Terr_ 3y ago
      > Right, [San Diego / Little Saigon / Chinatown is] called "ghettoization". Just because a geographic concentration originated from forced-segregation policies over a century ago does not automatically mean those bad policies and pejorative status continues today. > It's not really a good recipe for a safe, prosperous nation. [...] exploited so many immigrants Hold up, I think the goalposts are moving a bit here: Earlier you said it was about "supporting themselves" economically. However now it sounds like no amount of economic-self-sufficiency is enough--you're saying those people ought to be blocked/deported unless they can satisfy some ill-defined requirement about where they live and who they socialize with. > bring in millions of people and all they can do is work as exploited workers in restaurants I am doubtful that millions of people who *checks comment-thread* have doctorate degrees and PhDs will be arriving to work for the rest of their lives in restaurants. If they do... well, then they're probably choosing it to escape something crappy enough that we should be letting them in for humanitarian reasons anyway.
  - Terr_ 3y ago
    Also: 1. If being unable to support themselves is the concern, why not make that the actual requirement to stay... Versus of an indirect and error-prone language requirement set by what are probably a bunch of old white monolingual men in Washington, DC? 2. Automatic translation tools have advanced by leaps and bounds over the last few decades.
    - midoridensha 3y ago
      >If being unable to support themselves is the concern, why not make that the actual requirement to stay... That's a good idea. That's how it is here in Japan: knowing the language is good, and gets you some points on your visa, but it's not a requirement. If you have a high-paying job offer from a sponsoring company, and a good educational and professional background (or other factors, like if you're in academia), then that's good too. They figure you'll learn the language on your own in that case. If you have no education and no way to support yourself, and can't communicate with anyone, why would they want you? Unless it's to exploit you. I don't think we should be promoting exploitation. >Versus of an indirect and error-prone language requirement set by what are probably a bunch of old white monolingual men in Washington, DC? US doesn't have a language requirement. We're talking about Canada, so you mean a bunch of white bilingual (English/French) people in Ottawa.
- iancmceachern 3y ago
  Have you even traveled? There are large pockets of all kinds of folks all kinds of places. There is even a city in Mexico with a huge Chinese population. Americans travel all over expecting to just use English and get by (myself included). You can absolutely do so, I've known many, Americans in Paris, Chinese in Mexico, French in America, on and on

tutorialmanager 3y ago

The US prioritises an ability to swim through a river, climb a small fence, and/or trudge across some desert.

Clent 3y ago
Most immigrants do not arrive via the southern border.
- fakedang 3y ago
  The prioritized ones seem to.
Ekaros 3y ago
It started with surviving a cruise over ocean... So I don't think that is much different in that sense.

midoridensha 3y ago

It's much the same in Japan, though education, work experience, and salary count for more than the language.