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This kind of brain-reading certainly seems to be in the same general species as lie detection. So it must exist. An AI device that takes a thousand data points
by swayvil 3y ago
This kind of brain-reading certainly seems to be in the same general species as lie detection.
So it must exist. An AI device that takes a thousand data points off your brain and tells you lie or not.
What would we do if we had a ~100% accurate lie detector? How would that go down, socially?
- causi 3y agoUnless someone figures out a way to do this without surgery from ten feet away the answer is that it won't.
- swayvil 3y agoYa I was thinking the same thing. Requiring a brain operation to make it work would be a deal breaker. Need an MRI or something.
- xwdv 3y agoIt would make trials much more straight forward events and allow us to deliver justice at scale, since we would now have a digital engine of truth.
- swayvil 3y agoAnd then we demand that all our police and lawmakers and public servants get hooked up to the machine and then the next day it's illegal tech.
- userbinator 3y agosince we would now have a digital engine of truth. What are we living in, a dystopian sci-fi universe?
- Vecr 3y agoIf that's the sensitivity, what's the specificity? How well does it translate from the population it's trained on to other populations? In what contexts is the type of lying it detects useful to detect? I would assume using it on someone in a criminal investigation context without their permission would be a 5th and 6th amendment violation (as it would almost entirely subvert the usefulness of legal representation).
- criley2 3y agoThere can never be a 100% accurate lie detector, only a 100% "thinks they're telling the truth detector". Ultimately human memory is deeply flawed and we're capable of having entirely false memories and swearing on our lives to things that never occurred. A machine which can perfectly read our brains can only get this messy imperfect mix. Even in the sense of political intrigue, is it so hard to imagine someone so brainwashed they truly believe the lie they are telling you?
- circuit10 3y agoI would only call something a lie if it’s conscious and intentional, otherwise it’s a mistake
- nerdponx 3y agoThat seems like a pretty big leap. This doesn't require language understanding, just a translation between muscle movements and sounds. Lie detection is way more complicated.
- swayvil 3y agoIt could detect intent to deceive. Or the brain-mode specific to lie-crafting.
- sharikous 3y agoWe don't have lie detectors even for AIs and we can look at every single bit inside them
- wizzwizz4 3y agoTo be fair, (most) humans have enough self awareness to (most of the time) know when they're lying. Theoretically, it's an easier problem.
- burkaman 3y agoIt is not in the same species, these systems have to be trained on every individual brain, they are not reading some objective signal that is the same for everyone. > For weeks, Ann worked with the team to train the system’s artificial intelligence algorithms to recognize her unique brain signals for speech. This involved repeating different phrases from a 1,024-word conversational vocabulary over and over again until the computer recognized the brain activity patterns associated with all the basic sounds of speech. To use this type of system for lie detection, if such a thing is possible, you'd have to get each subject to give you thousands of example statements with truth/lie labels. This obviously defeats the purpose, and also doesn't really seem possible - does lying for a training exercise produce the same brain patterns as lying to actually cover something up? Probably not.
- swayvil 3y agoYour objections are that training is required and that where and how the lie is uttered might bear. Mere technical hurdles IMO.
- bagels 3y agoI would presume that someone being subject to a lie detector may have different incentives than those running the lie detector, and they may intentionally taint the data.
- TuringTest 3y agoI think the point is, who would deliberately train a system to detect their own lies?
- consumer451 3y ago> who would deliberately train a system to detect their own lies? Maybe an employee required to do so as part of on-boarding to a corporation or government org? Or maybe someone in the process of a passport or visa application? This podcast episode [0] with Sean Carroll and Nita Farahany scared the crap out of me on this topic, it seems inevitable. This is the time to regulate neuro access prior to it becoming big business, and part of the TSA screening process. [0] https://www.preposterousuniverse.com/podcast/2023/03/13/229-nita-farahany-on-ethics-law-and-neurotechnology/ https://www.preposterousuniverse.com/podcast/2023/03/13/229-...
- etrautmann 3y agono - this is not conceptually related to lie detection. Yes it uses ML to decode something, but that's where the similarity ends. This is decoding the patterns of brain activity used to generate speech.
- swayvil 3y agoWell yes. I'm thinking that if we can decode the brain in this one way then we can probably decode it in other ways too.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]