4 ms·

So gmail was making money off of personal emails as recently 2017. Why trust them? There is no good reason they shouldn’t e2ee that data.

onereplyac 3y ago
Except there is a reason. Encrypting email has very little to no benefit, since it is transmitted in plaintext and usually stored in plaintext on the recipient's side, your emails almost always exist in unencrypted form. On top of that it has major usability drawbacks, for example you cant ask the server to search emails for you anymore - all emails have to be downloaded on all your devices to be able to search - which is what skiff does. It will be okay at the start, and progressively get slower and use more space on your drive the more you use it.
- em-bee 3y ago
  i have 2.5 million emails in a 32GB datastore. no mailprovider is going to allow me to store that much mail, and search is actually quite fast. if it isn't for you, then get a better mail client.
  - mgraczyk 3y ago
    Google's cheapest paid plan ($6/month) gives you 30GB. The $12/month plan is 2TB of storage. I currently have over 30GB of email in Gmail and everything works fine.
    - mediumsmart 3y ago
      I have around 17GB of pop3fetchallnokeep in the mail folder and the backup is somewhere in the btreeflatfile heap in that UtahDataCenter free of charge training darkgpt 5.8
- nicce 3y ago
  > Except there is a reason. Encrypting email has very little to no benefit, since it is transmitted in plaintext and usually stored in plaintext on the recipient's side, your emails almost always exist in unencrypted form. On top of that it has major usability drawbacks, for example you cant ask the server to search emails for you anymore - all emails have to be downloaded on all your devices to be able to search - which is what skiff does. It will be okay at the start, and progressively get slower and use more space on your drive the more you use it. This are just old technical problems which are already solved, for example by Tutanota. Mails are not send in plaintext if they are encrypted, and mailbox can be encrypted too. Plaintext version of your data exist only in the memory of your computer while the session for your mail client is open. What it comes to the search - it does not matter anymore. We have enough computational power these days and storage to hold emails on devices. User experience is about the same. Increasingly, it is just optimisation problem which can be done right. Just don’t use Electron for your email app.
  - onereplyac 3y ago
    Unfortunately not even close. When the server gets the email it is not encrypted (unless the sender has a skiff address too, which is a very tiny portion...). And when you send an email to anyone outside skiff it is the same problem, the email has to be unencrypted so the server can send it in a form readable by the recepient. Without anything like PGP the server does not know the reciepent's public key, so it is impossible to encrypt it.
    - nicce 3y ago
      We might be talking about different encryption, since that does not sound E2EE at all. The point of the encryption is that server never sees the content. But that is true that if you use skiff to send message for someone, who is not using skiff, the message is unencrypted because receiver has no means to decrypt it. That is standrdisation issue. Apparantly PGP is not considered good enough. But if we had standards, we have techology to provide E2EE emails.
      - onereplyac 3y ago

onereplyac 3y ago

Except there is a reason. Encrypting email has very little to no benefit, since it is transmitted in plaintext and usually stored in plaintext on the recipient's side, your emails almost always exist in unencrypted form. On top of that it has major usability drawbacks, for example you cant ask the server to search emails for you anymore - all emails have to be downloaded on all your devices to be able to search - which is what skiff does. It will be okay at the start, and progressively get slower and use more space on your drive the more you use it.

em-bee 3y ago
i have 2.5 million emails in a 32GB datastore. no mailprovider is going to allow me to store that much mail, and search is actually quite fast. if it isn't for you, then get a better mail client.
- mgraczyk 3y ago
  Google's cheapest paid plan ($6/month) gives you 30GB. The $12/month plan is 2TB of storage. I currently have over 30GB of email in Gmail and everything works fine.
  - mediumsmart 3y ago
    I have around 17GB of pop3fetchallnokeep in the mail folder and the backup is somewhere in the btreeflatfile heap in that UtahDataCenter free of charge training darkgpt 5.8
nicce 3y ago
> Except there is a reason. Encrypting email has very little to no benefit, since it is transmitted in plaintext and usually stored in plaintext on the recipient's side, your emails almost always exist in unencrypted form. On top of that it has major usability drawbacks, for example you cant ask the server to search emails for you anymore - all emails have to be downloaded on all your devices to be able to search - which is what skiff does. It will be okay at the start, and progressively get slower and use more space on your drive the more you use it. This are just old technical problems which are already solved, for example by Tutanota. Mails are not send in plaintext if they are encrypted, and mailbox can be encrypted too. Plaintext version of your data exist only in the memory of your computer while the session for your mail client is open. What it comes to the search - it does not matter anymore. We have enough computational power these days and storage to hold emails on devices. User experience is about the same. Increasingly, it is just optimisation problem which can be done right. Just don’t use Electron for your email app.
- onereplyac 3y ago
  Unfortunately not even close. When the server gets the email it is not encrypted (unless the sender has a skiff address too, which is a very tiny portion...). And when you send an email to anyone outside skiff it is the same problem, the email has to be unencrypted so the server can send it in a form readable by the recepient. Without anything like PGP the server does not know the reciepent's public key, so it is impossible to encrypt it.
  - nicce 3y ago
    We might be talking about different encryption, since that does not sound E2EE at all. The point of the encryption is that server never sees the content. But that is true that if you use skiff to send message for someone, who is not using skiff, the message is unencrypted because receiver has no means to decrypt it. That is standrdisation issue. Apparantly PGP is not considered good enough. But if we had standards, we have techology to provide E2EE emails.
    - onereplyac 3y ago