4 ms·

Though I agree with your point, i don’t think it’s impossible to do full self driving with vision and an intelligent agent only. that being said as far as I kn

Though I agree with your point, i don’t think it’s impossible to do full self driving with vision and an intelligent agent only. that being said as far as I know the cameras they’re using aren’t good enough

gruturo 3y ago
It may not be impossible, but it may well be feasible only a good 5-15 years after it's successfully implemented with the assistance of LIDAR (or other technologies). LIDAR won't read the posted speed limit, it will only see the shape of the post. But it won't be blinded by reflections, it will never confuse the side of a truck with the sky, it won't miss an object or hole on the road due to poor contrast, etc. It's becoming very affordable, too.
- endisneigh 3y ago
  You can be an excellent driver even if you’re occasionally confused and blinded, etc. in my opinion the reason it doesn’t work today with vision is that it turns out more intelligence than musk thinks is required if you’re only using vision
  - pzo 3y ago
    also probably current cameras are not as great as human eyes - humans eyes are superior even to latest iphones pro. You still have to think about when taking photo e.g. Is the back lightning (sun) too aggressive ? Even HDR not always helps and all those processing still takes like ~1sec or more - with car driving at 100km/h you have to do such processing at 60fps minimum
  - nier 3y ago
    When I think back to the situations where I was blinded as a driver, I remember being able to help myself by blocking out the sun with my hand. This simple physical countermeasure is something that vision hardware currently cannot perform.
  - gruturo 3y ago
    I agree with you, and, furthermore: Why handicap yourself when there's an alternative? It used to be completely unaffordable for a mass produced sedan, so I could understand that, but 10 years later things have changed, and insisting on vision-only reeks of stubbornness and stupidity at this point.
mrguyorama 3y ago
The "cameras" will never be good enough because the eyeball isn't a camera and has way more info to work with than just a 2D array of colors. For example, your brain has way better depth info than just parallax in most cases, as it gets info about what is required to keep a distant object in focus and aligned in both eyes. These two values will not ever available to fixed cameras and yet provide direct measurements of distance for your brain.
- ProjectArcturis 3y ago
  You also have memory to infer how fast an object is moving, and where it's trying to go, in contrast to the purely feed-forward neural networks Tesla uses.

gruturo 3y ago

It may not be impossible, but it may well be feasible only a good 5-15 years after it's successfully implemented with the assistance of LIDAR (or other technologies). LIDAR won't read the posted speed limit, it will only see the shape of the post. But it won't be blinded by reflections, it will never confuse the side of a truck with the sky, it won't miss an object or hole on the road due to poor contrast, etc. It's becoming very affordable, too.

endisneigh 3y ago
You can be an excellent driver even if you’re occasionally confused and blinded, etc. in my opinion the reason it doesn’t work today with vision is that it turns out more intelligence than musk thinks is required if you’re only using vision
- pzo 3y ago
  also probably current cameras are not as great as human eyes - humans eyes are superior even to latest iphones pro. You still have to think about when taking photo e.g. Is the back lightning (sun) too aggressive ? Even HDR not always helps and all those processing still takes like ~1sec or more - with car driving at 100km/h you have to do such processing at 60fps minimum
- nier 3y ago
  When I think back to the situations where I was blinded as a driver, I remember being able to help myself by blocking out the sun with my hand. This simple physical countermeasure is something that vision hardware currently cannot perform.
- gruturo 3y ago
  I agree with you, and, furthermore: Why handicap yourself when there's an alternative? It used to be completely unaffordable for a mass produced sedan, so I could understand that, but 10 years later things have changed, and insisting on vision-only reeks of stubbornness and stupidity at this point.

mrguyorama 3y ago

The "cameras" will never be good enough because the eyeball isn't a camera and has way more info to work with than just a 2D array of colors. For example, your brain has way better depth info than just parallax in most cases, as it gets info about what is required to keep a distant object in focus and aligned in both eyes. These two values will not ever available to fixed cameras and yet provide direct measurements of distance for your brain.

ProjectArcturis 3y ago
You also have memory to infer how fast an object is moving, and where it's trying to go, in contrast to the purely feed-forward neural networks Tesla uses.