4 ms·

Nice article. I would like to add another germane point to these discussions that the article didn't mention: > back-of-the-envelope math suggests that the cos

Nice article. I would like to add another germane point to these discussions that the article didn't mention: > back-of-the-envelope math suggests that the cost of giving each American household a battery wall unit, conservatively priced at around $8,000, would cost something on the order of a trillion dollars Back-of-the-envelope math like this, when applied to the real world, almost always fails. This computation was just the number of households in the US (~124 million) times $8,000. In real world, stuff gets more expensive as you demand a larger share of the stuff's supply, because there's only so much batteries (and its component minerals) being produced in the world at any given time. Grid modernization to adapt to renewables is a fascinating subject, and I hope it gets more investment in all aspects.

smileysteve 3y ago
A battery per household is horrible inefficient though; Especially lithium tech versus liquid batteries. To prevent residential brownouts, the most important aspect is leveling air conditioner demand; this can be done a few ways 1. Modern Equipment with lower Locked Rotor Amps required to start over a shorter period of time (variable compressors, scroll compressors, start capacitors on reciprocating compressors) (more dc fixed magnet motors than induction motors) 2. Networked smart thermostats (ie Ecobee, Nest) with pre-cooling factors for weather, utility tie ins (time of use, community savings), equipment run time monitoring, 5 minute compressor off timers to reduce non equilibrium starts. Generally speaking, grid improvements are drastically improved with local substations having load leveling technologies, but (before we get to individuals) more locally at the transformer (~ per block) level.
- smileysteve 3y ago
  I was going through this list after Congressman Massie grilled Pete Buttigieg. 1. Over the last 10 years, refrigerators use about 1/2 as much electricity as they've switched to variable (digital inverter) compressors. 2. Over the last 10 years, HVAC systems use about 1/2 as much LockedRotorAmps (not even considering Mini Splits with variable compressors, even more efficient) 3. Washers and Dryers are more efficient; as they also switched to digital inverter motors. 4. Hot water heaters are twice as efficient as 20 years ago, especially with smart controllers, and then Heat Pump hot water heaters are 2x as efficient as those. 5. Ovens are more efficient with convection circulating fans 6. Moving from ~30 incandescent ~100w bulbs to LEDs in the average house reduces demand 97%; Similar can be said about TVs moving from Cathode Ray tubes to Fluorescent / Plasma to LED; Congressman Massie left a huge door open in line of questioning; because he is an early adopter with both Solar and an EV at his house; The answer Buttigieg could have given was that the Inflation Reduction Act will help strengthen our grid by incentivizing more Americans to both reduce their demand, and potentially strengthen our grid as Massie has done himself. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=avi9iBC8opU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=avi9iBC8opU
- ianburrell 3y ago
  I've wondered if the ideal place for battery storage would be substations. They usually have free space where could put some containers full of batteries. It would scale better than each house having their own. It can serve a whole neighborhood, and provide power if the grid goes down. The only thing that can't help with is when local distribution goes down.
  - smileysteve 3y ago
    Not only batteries, capacitors, and flywheels; but cap it off with solar too.

smileysteve 3y ago

A battery per household is horrible inefficient though; Especially lithium tech versus liquid batteries. To prevent residential brownouts, the most important aspect is leveling air conditioner demand; this can be done a few ways 1. Modern Equipment with lower Locked Rotor Amps required to start over a shorter period of time (variable compressors, scroll compressors, start capacitors on reciprocating compressors) (more dc fixed magnet motors than induction motors) 2. Networked smart thermostats (ie Ecobee, Nest) with pre-cooling factors for weather, utility tie ins (time of use, community savings), equipment run time monitoring, 5 minute compressor off timers to reduce non equilibrium starts. Generally speaking, grid improvements are drastically improved with local substations having load leveling technologies, but (before we get to individuals) more locally at the transformer (~ per block) level.

smileysteve 3y ago
I was going through this list after Congressman Massie grilled Pete Buttigieg. 1. Over the last 10 years, refrigerators use about 1/2 as much electricity as they've switched to variable (digital inverter) compressors. 2. Over the last 10 years, HVAC systems use about 1/2 as much LockedRotorAmps (not even considering Mini Splits with variable compressors, even more efficient) 3. Washers and Dryers are more efficient; as they also switched to digital inverter motors. 4. Hot water heaters are twice as efficient as 20 years ago, especially with smart controllers, and then Heat Pump hot water heaters are 2x as efficient as those. 5. Ovens are more efficient with convection circulating fans 6. Moving from ~30 incandescent ~100w bulbs to LEDs in the average house reduces demand 97%; Similar can be said about TVs moving from Cathode Ray tubes to Fluorescent / Plasma to LED; Congressman Massie left a huge door open in line of questioning; because he is an early adopter with both Solar and an EV at his house; The answer Buttigieg could have given was that the Inflation Reduction Act will help strengthen our grid by incentivizing more Americans to both reduce their demand, and potentially strengthen our grid as Massie has done himself. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=avi9iBC8opU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=avi9iBC8opU
ianburrell 3y ago
I've wondered if the ideal place for battery storage would be substations. They usually have free space where could put some containers full of batteries. It would scale better than each house having their own. It can serve a whole neighborhood, and provide power if the grid goes down. The only thing that can't help with is when local distribution goes down.
- smileysteve 3y ago
  Not only batteries, capacitors, and flywheels; but cap it off with solar too.