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30 years experience says the best way to use a breadboard is don't use one. They suffer from contact wear, stray capacitance and inductance, unreliable contact

by baz00 3y ago

30 years experience says the best way to use a breadboard is don't use one. They suffer from contact wear, stray capacitance and inductance, unreliable contacts and rather non optimal signal routing. This slowly adds up to pending headaches like failing circuits and ones that can't be reproduced. Even the nice 3M ones are problematic. Refer to https://www.analog.com/media/en/technical-documentation/application-notes/an47fa.pdf https://www.analog.com/media/en/technical-documentation/appl... ... AN47-26 breadboarding techniques. I tend to use single sided copper clad board and build stuff rats nest. Drill some holes through the board and screw it to the inside of a die cast box lid and for a one off it's good. Works fine up to 1GHz or so with some thinking unlike breadboards (1MHz if the planets are aligned appropriately). Also works for high voltage and high current stuff. If you have lots of digital, flip the ICs upside down and use kynar for signal routing. Here's one I did last year where someone stole the internal oscillator out of an RF signal generator so I built one from the service manual schematics. Prototype: https://imgur.com/KLnEzcs https://imgur.com/KLnEzcs ... This was "productionised" onto a custom PCB: https://imgur.com/WM44RYl https://imgur.com/WM44RYl

jcarrano 3y ago
I came here to say the same. I was bitten by faulty breadboards, now no more. Perfboard is not much more work to assemble and way more reliable.
kd5bjo 3y ago
There are plenty of projects for which solderless breadboards are unsuitable, but there are also lots for which they're perfectly fine. Lots of hobbyists and most professionals will outgrow solderless breadboards sooner or later, but they're still a good place to get started.
- baz00 3y ago
  Spend an hour in an undergrad EE lab helping people with fucked up breadboards and you change your mind rapidly. Same goes for hobbyists but they don’t have someone to help them available. I’ve seen people chewed up for hours debugging a circuit and find it’s a breadboard problem.
  - JohnFen 3y ago
    Yeah, I wouldn't use them in that sort of setting. I do use breadboards for quickly checking out relatively simple, low-frequency circuits. But if the circuit appears to be malfunctioning, I suspect the breadboard first (after double-checking the circuit wiring). I also think of breadboards as being consumables, and as soon as one gives the slightest whiff of trouble, I get rid of it. I think they're very useful tools, but you need to be aware of how iffy they actually are and use them appropriately.
0xmarcin 3y ago
I think they selling point is that you do not have to solder. Soldering is not for everyone: you need expensive equipment, soldering in an appartment without proper ventilation is quite harmful to your health, young kids should not solder. I used breadboard to play with electronics during winter in my small appartment at that time. No troubles with fumes, no need to buy expensive soldering station, no need to safely get rid of tin with lead. This was a good way to start, now I own a soldering station but now I also know that I need it about 2 or 3 a month.
- JohnFen 3y ago
  > you need expensive equipment Basic soldering equipment is quite inexpensive. A basic soldering iron can be had for about the same price as a small breadboard. The good stuff gets pricey, but if you aren't doing a lot of soldering, you don't need the good stuff. > soldering in an appartment without proper ventilation is quite harmful to your health If you have a window and aren't soldering frequently, it's not really all that bad. > young kids should not solder. Why not? I was taught to solder when I was 8, and I'm very grateful for that.
- baz00 3y ago
  You’re overstating the risks. Respiratory risks of solder aware minimal, particularly ironically the leaded variety. If you’re worried solder with the window open or get an extractor. I haven’t needed either in the last 40 odd years. The lead itself is harmless unless you ingest lots of it. Wash your hands. That is all you need to do. Take it to the WEEE bin or waste disposal if you discard it. I learned to solder when I was 8. My kids when they were 10. It’s fine. I built my first amateur radio transceiver when I was 12! Soldering kit is cheap. Even decent metcal stuff can be had for virtually nothing if you shop around.
  - VilleOr 3y ago
    > Rosin-based solder flux fume is now regarded as one of the most significant causes of occupational asthma in Britain. Source: https://www.hse.gov.uk/lung-disease/electronics-soldering.htm https://www.hse.gov.uk/lung-disease/electronics-soldering.ht... Children are up to five times more likely to get lead in their bodies, so under no circumstances should children get leaded tin in their hands. It is possible to get lead poisoning through the skin even as an adult if lead is handled daily. Fortunately, nowadays lead-free tin is used, but I know that some hobbyists still have a lot of lead in their stores.

by baz00 3y ago

jcarrano 3y ago

I came here to say the same. I was bitten by faulty breadboards, now no more. Perfboard is not much more work to assemble and way more reliable.

kd5bjo 3y ago

There are plenty of projects for which solderless breadboards are unsuitable, but there are also lots for which they're perfectly fine. Lots of hobbyists and most professionals will outgrow solderless breadboards sooner or later, but they're still a good place to get started.

baz00 3y ago
Spend an hour in an undergrad EE lab helping people with fucked up breadboards and you change your mind rapidly. Same goes for hobbyists but they don’t have someone to help them available. I’ve seen people chewed up for hours debugging a circuit and find it’s a breadboard problem.
- JohnFen 3y ago
  Yeah, I wouldn't use them in that sort of setting. I do use breadboards for quickly checking out relatively simple, low-frequency circuits. But if the circuit appears to be malfunctioning, I suspect the breadboard first (after double-checking the circuit wiring). I also think of breadboards as being consumables, and as soon as one gives the slightest whiff of trouble, I get rid of it. I think they're very useful tools, but you need to be aware of how iffy they actually are and use them appropriately.

0xmarcin 3y ago

I think they selling point is that you do not have to solder. Soldering is not for everyone: you need expensive equipment, soldering in an appartment without proper ventilation is quite harmful to your health, young kids should not solder. I used breadboard to play with electronics during winter in my small appartment at that time. No troubles with fumes, no need to buy expensive soldering station, no need to safely get rid of tin with lead. This was a good way to start, now I own a soldering station but now I also know that I need it about 2 or 3 a month.

JohnFen 3y ago
> you need expensive equipment Basic soldering equipment is quite inexpensive. A basic soldering iron can be had for about the same price as a small breadboard. The good stuff gets pricey, but if you aren't doing a lot of soldering, you don't need the good stuff. > soldering in an appartment without proper ventilation is quite harmful to your health If you have a window and aren't soldering frequently, it's not really all that bad. > young kids should not solder. Why not? I was taught to solder when I was 8, and I'm very grateful for that.
baz00 3y ago
You’re overstating the risks. Respiratory risks of solder aware minimal, particularly ironically the leaded variety. If you’re worried solder with the window open or get an extractor. I haven’t needed either in the last 40 odd years. The lead itself is harmless unless you ingest lots of it. Wash your hands. That is all you need to do. Take it to the WEEE bin or waste disposal if you discard it. I learned to solder when I was 8. My kids when they were 10. It’s fine. I built my first amateur radio transceiver when I was 12! Soldering kit is cheap. Even decent metcal stuff can be had for virtually nothing if you shop around.
- VilleOr 3y ago
  > Rosin-based solder flux fume is now regarded as one of the most significant causes of occupational asthma in Britain. Source: https://www.hse.gov.uk/lung-disease/electronics-soldering.htm https://www.hse.gov.uk/lung-disease/electronics-soldering.ht... Children are up to five times more likely to get lead in their bodies, so under no circumstances should children get leaded tin in their hands. It is possible to get lead poisoning through the skin even as an adult if lead is handled daily. Fortunately, nowadays lead-free tin is used, but I know that some hobbyists still have a lot of lead in their stores.