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C3H8 + 5O2 => 3CO2 + 4H20 reminder that propane burns into CO2 - this process doesn't actually unlock any new energy source, it merely just reverses a reaction

C3H8 + 5O2 => 3CO2 + 4H20 reminder that propane burns into CO2 - this process doesn't actually unlock any new energy source, it merely just reverses a reaction that has already taken place (presumably with electricity or some other form of energy) this isn't some kind of miracle infinite energy source to solve climate change woes, more like an interesting way to convert one usable form of energy (electricity) into another (a petrochemical)

nine_k 3y ago
But this is perfect. A complete reversion of the reaction, without any additional interesting inputs or intermediate stages. You can imagine a closed-cycle, isolated "battety" that discharges into sparkling water, and charges back into fuel and oxygen. This is exactly the miracle solution that can turn CO₂ back into fuel, which can be burned again in existing ICEs and gas turbines, then turned into fuel again, powered by solar electricity. Collecting and concentrating the CO₂ is going to be a task in itself, but things like power plants or steelmaking furnaces offer high-concentration, pre-heated CO₂.
- war-is-peace 3y ago
  that would be cool, but wouldn't something simpler like electrolysis of water into hydrogen/oxygen work much better? I haven't the effort to do the math, but it would require less steps, less complexity, and less cutting edge catalysts with unknown lifetimes
  - nine_k 3y ago
    No. It's hugely inefficient, so it requires more solar power. Hydrogen is hard to store and use; unlike propane, it penetrates through plastics and even metals. Hydrogen is a good rocket fuel if you need top performance and cost is no object. Propane is very convenient, and can be reused across the existing LNG infrastructure.
  - mtrimpe 3y ago
    Hydrogen is very difficult to use as a direct fuel source. This recent video gives a good overview of all the challenges a hydrogen engine has to overcome: https://youtu.be/DGL5g91KwLA https://youtu.be/DGL5g91KwLA
    - war-is-peace 3y ago
      thanks
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
rocqua 3y ago
The value lies in the fact that we already have a lot of infrastructure (including storage) that uses propane. By switching from fossil propane to this green propane we can indirectly 'electrify' entire swaths of energy consumption. It's scary to me how good this is. Because if it works, we can effectively continue as normal. Which is not to be expected, and might cause us to slack off since the pressure is gone.
lost_tourist 3y ago
It would work well with wind and solar as energy storage, or even tidal or geothermal. Making it great for storing power from variable power systems. Propane is extremely easy to distribute.

nine_k 3y ago

But this is perfect. A complete reversion of the reaction, without any additional interesting inputs or intermediate stages. You can imagine a closed-cycle, isolated "battety" that discharges into sparkling water, and charges back into fuel and oxygen. This is exactly the miracle solution that can turn CO₂ back into fuel, which can be burned again in existing ICEs and gas turbines, then turned into fuel again, powered by solar electricity. Collecting and concentrating the CO₂ is going to be a task in itself, but things like power plants or steelmaking furnaces offer high-concentration, pre-heated CO₂.

war-is-peace 3y ago
that would be cool, but wouldn't something simpler like electrolysis of water into hydrogen/oxygen work much better? I haven't the effort to do the math, but it would require less steps, less complexity, and less cutting edge catalysts with unknown lifetimes
- nine_k 3y ago
  No. It's hugely inefficient, so it requires more solar power. Hydrogen is hard to store and use; unlike propane, it penetrates through plastics and even metals. Hydrogen is a good rocket fuel if you need top performance and cost is no object. Propane is very convenient, and can be reused across the existing LNG infrastructure.
- mtrimpe 3y ago
  Hydrogen is very difficult to use as a direct fuel source. This recent video gives a good overview of all the challenges a hydrogen engine has to overcome: https://youtu.be/DGL5g91KwLA https://youtu.be/DGL5g91KwLA
  - war-is-peace 3y ago
    thanks

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

rocqua 3y ago

The value lies in the fact that we already have a lot of infrastructure (including storage) that uses propane. By switching from fossil propane to this green propane we can indirectly 'electrify' entire swaths of energy consumption. It's scary to me how good this is. Because if it works, we can effectively continue as normal. Which is not to be expected, and might cause us to slack off since the pressure is gone.

lost_tourist 3y ago

It would work well with wind and solar as energy storage, or even tidal or geothermal. Making it great for storing power from variable power systems. Propane is extremely easy to distribute.