3 ms·

Would the 2008 Obama campaign be a counter argument to this? So yes his schtick was “change from Bush”, but was it really hatred from the mass movement? I don’t

Would the 2008 Obama campaign be a counter argument to this? So yes his schtick was “change from Bush”, but was it really hatred from the mass movement? I don’t recall feeling that back then, but definitely feeling a more inspirational vibe.

philwelch 3y ago
Obama 2008 was a personality cult. Many successful presidential campaigns are.
- xNeil 3y ago
  *every successful presidential campaign is a personality cult.
  - lamp_book 3y ago
    Joe Biden? Pretty much the quintessential Not the Other Guy vote.
    - Nevermark 3y ago
      Sometimes "Not the other Guy" has a charisma all of its own!
  - memling 3y ago
    Perhaps every modern campaign. James Garfield is a counterexample from history...but of course he was shot and subsequently killed by the doctors.
tootie 3y ago
I don't think the Obama campaign really maps to being a "movement" in the sense of the author. Presidential elections happen whether or not there's a movement. A lot of his most ardent supporters may have been motivated by similar feelings, but not most people who voted for him and it's not like he exploited their devotion for anything beyond the normal responsibilities of being president.
brutusborn 3y ago
Are you saying you don’t think Obama supporters generally hate republicans/trump? I’m a foreigner so my only data is from random Americans I talk to, but all progressive Americans seem to have a strong hatred for conservatives. Same thing for Trump supporters hating progressives.
- nobody9999 3y ago
  >Are you saying you don’t think Obama supporters generally hate republicans/trump? As an American (and somewhat to the left of Obama or Biden for that matter), I don't hate anyone. I don't care for many of the policies or the attempts to scapegoat minority groups (LGBTQIA+, those with higher melanin content, etc.) espoused by US "conservatives" (I use quotes because most of those policy proposals aren't "conservative," but rather are radical reactionary policies), but I don't hate such folks. What's more, those with an axe to grind or those that benefit from division and distrust often claim that the most extreme positions which aren't supported by anyone but the lunatic fringe is the mainstream belief among those they wish to demonize. In truth, the vast majority of Americans just want to have a decent life, with equal opportunity to succeed. But that doesn't drive political donations, advertising engagement or voter turnout. As such, we end up with the most extreme positions held up as "mainstream," when they're mostly just crackpot ideas that people would otherwise reject out of hand. It's sad and more than a little frightening, to be honest.

philwelch 3y ago

Obama 2008 was a personality cult. Many successful presidential campaigns are.

xNeil 3y ago
*every successful presidential campaign is a personality cult.
- lamp_book 3y ago
  Joe Biden? Pretty much the quintessential Not the Other Guy vote.
  - Nevermark 3y ago
    Sometimes "Not the other Guy" has a charisma all of its own!
- memling 3y ago
  Perhaps every modern campaign. James Garfield is a counterexample from history...but of course he was shot and subsequently killed by the doctors.

tootie 3y ago

I don't think the Obama campaign really maps to being a "movement" in the sense of the author. Presidential elections happen whether or not there's a movement. A lot of his most ardent supporters may have been motivated by similar feelings, but not most people who voted for him and it's not like he exploited their devotion for anything beyond the normal responsibilities of being president.

brutusborn 3y ago

Are you saying you don’t think Obama supporters generally hate republicans/trump? I’m a foreigner so my only data is from random Americans I talk to, but all progressive Americans seem to have a strong hatred for conservatives. Same thing for Trump supporters hating progressives.

nobody9999 3y ago
>Are you saying you don’t think Obama supporters generally hate republicans/trump? As an American (and somewhat to the left of Obama or Biden for that matter), I don't hate anyone. I don't care for many of the policies or the attempts to scapegoat minority groups (LGBTQIA+, those with higher melanin content, etc.) espoused by US "conservatives" (I use quotes because most of those policy proposals aren't "conservative," but rather are radical reactionary policies), but I don't hate such folks. What's more, those with an axe to grind or those that benefit from division and distrust often claim that the most extreme positions which aren't supported by anyone but the lunatic fringe is the mainstream belief among those they wish to demonize. In truth, the vast majority of Americans just want to have a decent life, with equal opportunity to succeed. But that doesn't drive political donations, advertising engagement or voter turnout. As such, we end up with the most extreme positions held up as "mainstream," when they're mostly just crackpot ideas that people would otherwise reject out of hand. It's sad and more than a little frightening, to be honest.