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> A 2019 study led by Nagler showed that the gut of healthy infants harbored a specific class of allergy-protective bacteria not found in infants with cow’s mi

> A 2019 study led by Nagler showed that the gut of healthy infants harbored a specific class of allergy-protective bacteria not found in infants with cow’s milk allergy. Between milk being a significant growth factor for kids and now this data about allergy-proofing, I seriously worry about the public mudslinging against dairy for political reasons. A lot of people are probably misled to think dairy is harmful for their children when it is the exact opposite.

jjallen 3y ago
Some of our children were allergic to dairy though. It can’t be beneficial when they’re actually allergic to it.
- waihtis 3y ago
  the article talks about it - the best antidote to allergy is early introduction: > Right around the late ‘80s and early ‘90s, when food allergy rates were starting to increase, the American Academy of Pediatrics said to withhold peanuts and allergenic foods from pregnant mothers, from nursing mothers and from children with risk of allergy until they’re four years old. That was exactly the wrong advice, and that fueled the fire and caused even more increase. Now all of the push is for early introduction.” of course there are cases of severe allergy, but these seem to be quite rare. as everything today, allergy is also way overdiagnosed by lazy & fearful doctors.
  - jebarker 3y ago
    Yeah, our daughter was born with a cow milk protein allergy. She got early introduction via breast milk and it just made her really sick, it was a tough first few months until we figure out the problem. My wife stopped eating dairy and our daughters symptoms were gone in less than two weeks. I hope we can find a cure but early introduction definitely wasn't it.
    - waihtis 3y ago
      Same situation here. For us it went away with gradually introducing dairy to her and that was the protocol given to us by the doc here. She hasn't developed an appetite for cows milk yet (prefers oat), but enjoys many other kinds of dairy now, like cheese, yoghurts etc. without any symptoms.
      - jebarker 3y ago
        That's what I'm hoping we can do too. We had one failed attempt at a dairy ladder and are waiting for the doc to tell us when to try again.
- hulitu 3y ago
  What kind of diary ? There are cows who never eat grass.
colordrops 3y ago
What does milk being a "growth factor for kids" mean? That statement needs to be backed up with some clarity and data. The majority of the Earth's population is intolerant to lactose, a component in cow's milk, so it's patently false that milk is some fundamental and crucial part of the human diet.
- watwut 3y ago
  In the geographic area where I live, milk (cow, sheep, goat) was indeed one of the most important food items. And milk intolerance was and still is rare. The milk always also seen as the thing to give to kids so they grow. And milk was actually practical option, cause you don't have to store it, you don't kill the animal for it, is less work to grow then plants, has tons of calories in a place where getting enough calories is not easy.
- waihtis 3y ago
  For example: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0306919223000830 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S030691922... > ...increases in milk consumption over time are associated with large reductions in child stunting even after controlling for important confounding factors. Countries with high rates of stunting should therefore consider nutrition-sensitive strategies to increase dairy consumption among young children... given how lost a significant populace in even the western world are in regards to nutrition it can surely be considered appropriate here too.
- naasking 3y ago
  > The majority of the Earth's population is intolerant to lactose I don't believe this is true of infants, people tend to develop lactose intolerance as they mature. Milk is an exceptionally good source of all kinds of vitamins, minerals, fats and even protein. Seems crazy, but studies have found that you absorb milk faster than water when dehydrated.
- soudiere 3y ago
  Your reasoning is erroneous. "Humans do not produce lactase, ergo it's false milk is fundamental/crucial". Humans do not produce the enzymes to digest some dietary fiber, ergo it's not fundamental/crucial. The last sentence is false. Consuming an excessive amount of any type of oligo or polysaccharide will result in basically a laxative effect, GI discomfort etc. You've got a few options, consume exogenous enzymes (lactaid pills), avoidance, or colonize your GI tract with bacteria that do produce lactase, and feed them a small amount every day (start at 1 gram of milk in your coffee, add 1 gram each day)
sundvor 3y ago
Grew up with copious amounts of Norwegian cow milk - and zero allergies. :) Back then we were free roaming kids as opposed to today, where I now am in Melbourne Aus and it's very very different. However, neither of my children have picked up any either. The fear for peanut allergies was so big that we introduced peanut butter to them at GP's office with epipen at the ready (very early in their lives). Feels a bit crazy, but that did get them introduced safely and early.
- waihtis 3y ago
  Roaming outside and generally getting your hands dirty in all kinds of soil is also, btw, a potentially significant factor in relation to gut bacteria. That is something I still think the Scandis (and here in FIN) have a somewhat special emphasis on.
- timc3 3y ago
  I grew up on a diary farm in the UK and spent large amounts of time outdoors and had access to a lot of milk. I was strongly allergic to milk (not just lactose). Was also allergic to other things.
sdeframond 3y ago
> this data about allergy-proofing Are you saying that milk prevents allergies? What I read from the article is that gut bacteria seem to prevent allergy, and that kids with an allergy to cow milk were missing the gut bacteria that would have prevented such allergy.
- naasking 3y ago
  Yes, but you can lose that gut bacteria by starving them of the food they need, as you would with avoidance.
  - nerdponx 3y ago
    In this case that food is probably not cows milk, typically being pasteurized before being sold. This is not a debate about macronutrition, it's a debate about the particular distributions of guy bacteria in different people
    - mr-ron 3y ago
      I dont think the commenter is saying that they are lacking the bacteria. If they have a bacteria that feeds on lactose / milk, and they give pasteurized milk, ,it will promote growth of that bacteria. Only if they dont have the bacteria at all would pasteurized made a difference.
      - nerdponx 3y ago
        But it's not even clear that the bacteria feeds on the milk. There could be other mechanisms of action for preventing or suppressing allergy.

jjallen 3y ago

Some of our children were allergic to dairy though. It can’t be beneficial when they’re actually allergic to it.

waihtis 3y ago
the article talks about it - the best antidote to allergy is early introduction: > Right around the late ‘80s and early ‘90s, when food allergy rates were starting to increase, the American Academy of Pediatrics said to withhold peanuts and allergenic foods from pregnant mothers, from nursing mothers and from children with risk of allergy until they’re four years old. That was exactly the wrong advice, and that fueled the fire and caused even more increase. Now all of the push is for early introduction.” of course there are cases of severe allergy, but these seem to be quite rare. as everything today, allergy is also way overdiagnosed by lazy & fearful doctors.
- jebarker 3y ago
  Yeah, our daughter was born with a cow milk protein allergy. She got early introduction via breast milk and it just made her really sick, it was a tough first few months until we figure out the problem. My wife stopped eating dairy and our daughters symptoms were gone in less than two weeks. I hope we can find a cure but early introduction definitely wasn't it.
  - waihtis 3y ago
    Same situation here. For us it went away with gradually introducing dairy to her and that was the protocol given to us by the doc here. She hasn't developed an appetite for cows milk yet (prefers oat), but enjoys many other kinds of dairy now, like cheese, yoghurts etc. without any symptoms.
    - jebarker 3y ago
      That's what I'm hoping we can do too. We had one failed attempt at a dairy ladder and are waiting for the doc to tell us when to try again.
hulitu 3y ago
What kind of diary ? There are cows who never eat grass.

colordrops 3y ago

What does milk being a "growth factor for kids" mean? That statement needs to be backed up with some clarity and data. The majority of the Earth's population is intolerant to lactose, a component in cow's milk, so it's patently false that milk is some fundamental and crucial part of the human diet.

watwut 3y ago
In the geographic area where I live, milk (cow, sheep, goat) was indeed one of the most important food items. And milk intolerance was and still is rare. The milk always also seen as the thing to give to kids so they grow. And milk was actually practical option, cause you don't have to store it, you don't kill the animal for it, is less work to grow then plants, has tons of calories in a place where getting enough calories is not easy.
waihtis 3y ago
For example: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0306919223000830 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S030691922... > ...increases in milk consumption over time are associated with large reductions in child stunting even after controlling for important confounding factors. Countries with high rates of stunting should therefore consider nutrition-sensitive strategies to increase dairy consumption among young children... given how lost a significant populace in even the western world are in regards to nutrition it can surely be considered appropriate here too.
naasking 3y ago
> The majority of the Earth's population is intolerant to lactose I don't believe this is true of infants, people tend to develop lactose intolerance as they mature. Milk is an exceptionally good source of all kinds of vitamins, minerals, fats and even protein. Seems crazy, but studies have found that you absorb milk faster than water when dehydrated.
soudiere 3y ago
Your reasoning is erroneous. "Humans do not produce lactase, ergo it's false milk is fundamental/crucial". Humans do not produce the enzymes to digest some dietary fiber, ergo it's not fundamental/crucial. The last sentence is false. Consuming an excessive amount of any type of oligo or polysaccharide will result in basically a laxative effect, GI discomfort etc. You've got a few options, consume exogenous enzymes (lactaid pills), avoidance, or colonize your GI tract with bacteria that do produce lactase, and feed them a small amount every day (start at 1 gram of milk in your coffee, add 1 gram each day)

sundvor 3y ago

Grew up with copious amounts of Norwegian cow milk - and zero allergies. :) Back then we were free roaming kids as opposed to today, where I now am in Melbourne Aus and it's very very different. However, neither of my children have picked up any either. The fear for peanut allergies was so big that we introduced peanut butter to them at GP's office with epipen at the ready (very early in their lives). Feels a bit crazy, but that did get them introduced safely and early.

waihtis 3y ago
Roaming outside and generally getting your hands dirty in all kinds of soil is also, btw, a potentially significant factor in relation to gut bacteria. That is something I still think the Scandis (and here in FIN) have a somewhat special emphasis on.
timc3 3y ago
I grew up on a diary farm in the UK and spent large amounts of time outdoors and had access to a lot of milk. I was strongly allergic to milk (not just lactose). Was also allergic to other things.

sdeframond 3y ago

> this data about allergy-proofing Are you saying that milk prevents allergies? What I read from the article is that gut bacteria seem to prevent allergy, and that kids with an allergy to cow milk were missing the gut bacteria that would have prevented such allergy.

naasking 3y ago
Yes, but you can lose that gut bacteria by starving them of the food they need, as you would with avoidance.
- nerdponx 3y ago
  In this case that food is probably not cows milk, typically being pasteurized before being sold. This is not a debate about macronutrition, it's a debate about the particular distributions of guy bacteria in different people
  - mr-ron 3y ago
    I dont think the commenter is saying that they are lacking the bacteria. If they have a bacteria that feeds on lactose / milk, and they give pasteurized milk, ,it will promote growth of that bacteria. Only if they dont have the bacteria at all would pasteurized made a difference.
    - nerdponx 3y ago
      But it's not even clear that the bacteria feeds on the milk. There could be other mechanisms of action for preventing or suppressing allergy.