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People want it both ways. They want private business to use the free market to develop more efficient and better solutions than a socialized system, but also a

People want it both ways. They want private business to use the free market to develop more efficient and better solutions than a socialized system, but also a limit to just how much that free market should compensate them. Either you're a capitalist or you're not. If the company in question was Disney or Apple, this wouldn't be appearing on HN in any capacity.

TylerE 3y ago
When there is so much fat cattery in the private sector, it is no longer more efficient.
pfannkuchen 3y ago
Have Disney or Apple received billions from taxpayers?
- forinti 3y ago
  In a way, they have, especially Disney, through IP laws. They have been granted protections which are not really fostering innovation and have just turned into rent seeking.
AdamJacobMuller 3y ago
We have the worst of both worlds now, socialized risk with privatized profit.
benjaminwootton 3y ago
Indeed. Moderna was real science, real innovation, and mostly huge globs of real private capital at risk. And though I'm skeptical on almost anything "Covid", most people think he saved the world with this vaccine technology which has big potential in future. This is capitalism 101, and the spoils need to go to the victor for it to work. Any government funding does muddy the waters slightly, but anything they did contribute I assume was for the public good.
- mrguyorama 3y ago
  >mostly real private capital at risk It absolutely was not! It was billions of public funding for a public health emergency.
  - benjaminwootton 3y ago
    As described in peer comments, mRNA was a platform developed in the decade prior with over $3 billion of private risk capital. The government came in to help them get the Covid vaccine to market using that existing platform.
beefpies 3y ago
Given that the relied on $1.7B of grant money, this would seem to be a heavily socialized effort but with privatized profits, no?
happytoexplain 3y ago
This is obviously a false binary. There is a complex multi-variable gradient between the two extremes. People don't want it both ways - they want it somewhere in the middle, and they reasonably disagree about where.

TylerE 3y ago

When there is so much fat cattery in the private sector, it is no longer more efficient.

pfannkuchen 3y ago

Have Disney or Apple received billions from taxpayers?

forinti 3y ago
In a way, they have, especially Disney, through IP laws. They have been granted protections which are not really fostering innovation and have just turned into rent seeking.

AdamJacobMuller 3y ago

We have the worst of both worlds now, socialized risk with privatized profit.

benjaminwootton 3y ago

Indeed. Moderna was real science, real innovation, and mostly huge globs of real private capital at risk. And though I'm skeptical on almost anything "Covid", most people think he saved the world with this vaccine technology which has big potential in future. This is capitalism 101, and the spoils need to go to the victor for it to work. Any government funding does muddy the waters slightly, but anything they did contribute I assume was for the public good.

mrguyorama 3y ago
>mostly real private capital at risk It absolutely was not! It was billions of public funding for a public health emergency.
- benjaminwootton 3y ago
  As described in peer comments, mRNA was a platform developed in the decade prior with over $3 billion of private risk capital. The government came in to help them get the Covid vaccine to market using that existing platform.

beefpies 3y ago

Given that the relied on $1.7B of grant money, this would seem to be a heavily socialized effort but with privatized profits, no?

happytoexplain 3y ago

This is obviously a false binary. There is a complex multi-variable gradient between the two extremes. People don't want it both ways - they want it somewhere in the middle, and they reasonably disagree about where.