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> ... on Legacy ISA. Since when is x86 legacy? > I'd rather a RISC-V Pinetab-V, based on the same JH7110 as VisionFive 2. Have you actually used one of those

• snvzz 3y ago
  >Since when is x86 legacy? Since the first commercial RISC chips obsoleted x86 in the 80s. >Have you actually used one of those? Yes, JH7110 on VisionFive 2. >They are excruciatingly slow. Less performance than most Raspberry Pi. Not my experience, owning VisionFive 2 and all raspberry pi B boards (1,2,3,3+ and 4), all of which have been used heavily. The CPU is much faster than RPi3b+'s while using way less power. Only a little slower than RPi4, and this is assuming the RPi4 has a huge heatsink like mine does. JH7110 doesn't require a heatsink nor throttle under load, for it stays under 75C even when running builds 24/7, yet is designed to survive 125C. Whereas everything else in the SoC is better. Especially the GPU, which in the RPi4 is anemic, and can barely keep up even for 2d at 1080p. The experience is much better on VisionFive 2 for even simple tasks like web browsing, and it's not even close. Night and day. Nevermind the upstream support effort[0] getting this far in just a few months (indiegogo delivery was in March), and follows standard RISC-V boot/firmware interface specifications, whereas Raspberry Pi is all bespoke and never cared much about upstreaming support. >Also competitive ARM based alternatives (such as Snapdragon) require many closed source blobs to function. Here I just do not understand what point you're trying to make. 0. https://rvspace.org/en/project/JH7110_Upstream_Plan https://rvspace.org/en/project/JH7110_Upstream_Plan
  • LeonM 3y ago
    > Only a little slower than RPi4 That was my point. It is slower than a RPI4, which is already too slow to use for anything serious. You can't expect StarLite to develop a tablet that is 'a little slower than RPi4', because nobody but you will buy it. And yes, your workflow may be possible on a low powered machine, but that is not how the majority of customers use a tablet. Until there is a serious competitor to modern x86 processors in terms of performance (which the JH7110 definitely isn't), RISC-V is not going to be offered in any commercial grade product anytime soon. > Here I just do not understand what point you're trying to make. The point I was trying to make, it that the other alternative, ARM, is also not suitable for StarLite's mission due to the closed blobs. So really, x86 is the only viable option they have.
    • snvzz 3y ago
      >RISC-V is not going to be offered in any commercial grade product anytime soon. That sentence isn't gonna age well. >That was my point. It is slower than a RPI4, which is already too slow to use for anything serious. I am still using my RPi1, but I guess my uses would not meet this arbitrary "something serious" tablet requirement. Joking aside, the RPi4 is actually very fast, and its shortcomings are elsewhere than the CPU. E.g. its GPU is grossly inadequate. Its video codec block can't encode. It lacks cryptography acceleration, so LUKS and SSL need to be done in the cpu with non-specialized instructions. These are issues JH7110 does not have. The experience is much better with JH7110. >The point I was trying to make, it that the other alternative, ARM, is also not suitable for StarLite's mission due to the closed blobs. Ah. They buy the FSF nonsense where closed blobs need to be burned into a ROM for the machine to quality as "open". Unfortunate, but I understand. RISC-V is inevitable.