4 ms·

Exactly. Mozilla is one of the worst tech companies pretending to do good. Tech wasn't always like this. In the 00s, everyone was for free speech. Mozilla wasn'

Exactly. Mozilla is one of the worst tech companies pretending to do good. Tech wasn't always like this. In the 00s, everyone was for free speech. Mozilla wasn't like this either. Hate to say it, but once the tech elite ( or more like the money elite controlling tech ) started talking about minority, lgbt and women's 'rights', they all started censoring, deplatforming, oppressing. Of course to fight 'hate speech' - whatever that means. It's like someone or some group flipped a switch and everyone from business to politics started singing a different tune. Once again, everything we accuse china of, we are. China has a single party controlled media right? How is it that one day, every commercial and media suddenly became so 'diverse'? Not saying it's a good thing or a bad thing. Just asking who flipped the switch?

ednxzu 3y ago
> the tech elite ( or more like the money elite controlling tech ) started talking about minority, lgbt and women's 'rights', they all started censoring, deplatforming, oppressing. That's an entirely different issue tho, a private company regulating its own product has nothing to do with a gov trying to restrict internet access to its citizens.
- goodbyesf 3y ago
  > That's an entirely different issue tho, a private company regulating its own product has nothing to do with a gov trying to restrict internet access to its citizens. That's my point. A private company regulating its own product is fine as long as it is private and independent. My point is that all 'private' companies appear to be following the same script which isn't something we'd expect from private independent companies. What's strange is that someone flipped a switch and all private companies, both political parties and government itself started behaving in the same manner. It's not just online censorship, it's the broad cultural campaign of chaos all under the banner of 'minority, lgbt and women's rights' mostly. Did every company in every industry from motorcycles to hollywood to news all magically decide to speak with one voice. Or is it that they were all directed to. In china, it's obvious who is in charge. The communist party. They give orders, everyone follows. Who is giving orders to the our private companies, political parties and government?
  - hooverd 3y ago
    That's the marketplace of ideas, baby.
  - eigenket 3y ago
    This comment feels a little conspiracy theory-ish. If a sufficiently big block of customers likes the idea of 'minority, lgbt and women's rights as you put it, they you're gonna see a bunch of companies trying to present themselves in a way that if favorable to that block.
    - goodbyesf 3y ago
      > This comment feels a little conspiracy theory-ish. Is conspiracy theory-ish code for true or obvious? Strange how 'conspiracy theory' ad hominems became popular recently. > If a sufficiently big block of customers likes the idea of 'minority, lgbt and women's rights as you put it, they you're gonna see a bunch of companies trying to present themselves in a way that if favorable to that block. Playing dumb I see. The country is majority christian and white. Using your logic, all commercials should be christian themed and advocate for whites.
      - eigenket 3y ago
        I'm not American, nor do I live in America, so my understanding of US culture is far from perfect, but from what I've seen it does appear that the vast majority of products, commercials and content in the US are aimed at white Christians. Pretty much everything I know from the USA is built around the primacy of white Christians. You guys literally say "one nation under god", in the pledge of allegiance you say in schools and at the start of congressional sessions (according to wikipeida) and your money says "in god we trust" on it.
      - johnnyanmac 3y ago
        >The country is majority christian and white. the country, yes. The world demographic of people who use your product, no. >all commercials should be christian themed and advocate for whites. and many commercials aimed at an older audiience, e.g. cable TV, do focus on this. Are we also playing dumb on the generational gap in technology, demographics using online media, and their ideaology?
cmh89 3y ago
That's quite a revisionist history. The early web was heavily moderated, just on a smaller scale. >Hate to say it, but once the tech elite ( or more like the money elite controlling tech ) started talking about minority, lgbt and women's 'rights', they all started censoring, deplatforming, oppressing. There's nothing stopping you from creating yet another "free speech" website. They typically fail because what the "tech elite" realize, along with most people, is that "free speech" websites devolve into people spamming racial slurs. Most people don't want to be around that. >Of course to fight 'hate speech' - whatever that means There is huge amounts of discourse on hate speech and what it means. There is plenty to read on the subject if you truly don't understand what it means. >It's like someone or some group flipped a switch and everyone from business to politics started singing a different tune. There was no switch. As the internet grew and became more diverse, the people who are typically the targets of hateful speech on the internet grew in their ability to influence companies. Back in the early 2000s, women avoided using a microphone because if they did, they would receive abuse or unwanted sexual comments. As the amount of women in video games increased, corporations become focused on the needs of their audience and how to make them feel welcome and buy more games. It's the same story for pretty much every other aspect of tech. What you're imagining as some conspiracy to "oppress" (lol) you because you can't spam racial slurs or spread race-based conspiracy theories is actually marketing executives realizing that catering to the extremely small "freeze peach" audience that wants to post odious content isn't an actual winning strategy for growing your business.
- smolder 3y ago
  Tangential, but, nowadays there are many digital spaces where saying "its not ok to hate cis white men" will get you a chorus of people saying "yes it is", followed by the boot.
  - aaaaarrrrrfffff 3y ago
    Very tangential. Those sorts of spaces do exist, and likewise pockets of racism, homophobia, transphobia, and misogeny all exist too. Hating cis white men for existing isn't something that should be acceptable, and death threats are never okay. And there are stressors that they do face - the suffering of others does not invalidate your own. But at the same time, there are also plenty of spaces mocking and belittling trans people, gay people, black people, and women in general. Those places also spam death threats, only these death threats are a little more credible, a little more real, because there is a history of real, physical violence against all those demographics. At the same time, there are many people who just genuinely don't understand, who were sheltered by the previous generation's willful ignorance, who phrase their questions in a way that looks, at first glance, like another unprompted malicious attack. The violence is why those communities react so strongly to those questions, and why they are so hostile to what is, by all accounts, a reasonable statement. In more closed off digital spaces, where conversation is focused around issues common to those demographics, like the violence or discrimination they've experienced, it might come across as uncaring - if a trans woman is talking about how a cute guy she was talking to at a bar stalked her and tried to beat her after she mentioned that she is trans, and someone chooses that moment to say that it's not okay to hate cis white men, it just comes across as intentionally uncaring, as if that person saw all of the murder, rape, violence, hatred, and discrimination these people experience in daily life, then decided, "Nope, your attitude towards white cis men is the real problem here". Open spaces often use the same heuristic to determine if someone is acting in good faith, but due to being open this tends to catch a lot of people who aren't familiar with the heuristic at play, and only see a perfectly legitimate statement that seems to put everyone in a frenzy. Now this isn't to say that these communities don't take it too far on their own. There are some which engage in doxxing, death threats, and all sorts of terrible behavior, but those communities are not the whole majority, just as the racist, transphobic, misogynistic and homophobic groups aren't the whole of cis white men. In both cases, those groups simply are the loudest.
redeeman 3y ago
unfortunately it seems a great many tech people are cowards and just goes along with all the BS. They have to collect a paycheck after all.

ednxzu 3y ago

> the tech elite ( or more like the money elite controlling tech ) started talking about minority, lgbt and women's 'rights', they all started censoring, deplatforming, oppressing. That's an entirely different issue tho, a private company regulating its own product has nothing to do with a gov trying to restrict internet access to its citizens.

goodbyesf 3y ago
> That's an entirely different issue tho, a private company regulating its own product has nothing to do with a gov trying to restrict internet access to its citizens. That's my point. A private company regulating its own product is fine as long as it is private and independent. My point is that all 'private' companies appear to be following the same script which isn't something we'd expect from private independent companies. What's strange is that someone flipped a switch and all private companies, both political parties and government itself started behaving in the same manner. It's not just online censorship, it's the broad cultural campaign of chaos all under the banner of 'minority, lgbt and women's rights' mostly. Did every company in every industry from motorcycles to hollywood to news all magically decide to speak with one voice. Or is it that they were all directed to. In china, it's obvious who is in charge. The communist party. They give orders, everyone follows. Who is giving orders to the our private companies, political parties and government?
- hooverd 3y ago
  That's the marketplace of ideas, baby.
- eigenket 3y ago
  This comment feels a little conspiracy theory-ish. If a sufficiently big block of customers likes the idea of 'minority, lgbt and women's rights as you put it, they you're gonna see a bunch of companies trying to present themselves in a way that if favorable to that block.
  - goodbyesf 3y ago
    > This comment feels a little conspiracy theory-ish. Is conspiracy theory-ish code for true or obvious? Strange how 'conspiracy theory' ad hominems became popular recently. > If a sufficiently big block of customers likes the idea of 'minority, lgbt and women's rights as you put it, they you're gonna see a bunch of companies trying to present themselves in a way that if favorable to that block. Playing dumb I see. The country is majority christian and white. Using your logic, all commercials should be christian themed and advocate for whites.
    - eigenket 3y ago
      I'm not American, nor do I live in America, so my understanding of US culture is far from perfect, but from what I've seen it does appear that the vast majority of products, commercials and content in the US are aimed at white Christians. Pretty much everything I know from the USA is built around the primacy of white Christians. You guys literally say "one nation under god", in the pledge of allegiance you say in schools and at the start of congressional sessions (according to wikipeida) and your money says "in god we trust" on it.
    - johnnyanmac 3y ago
      >The country is majority christian and white. the country, yes. The world demographic of people who use your product, no. >all commercials should be christian themed and advocate for whites. and many commercials aimed at an older audiience, e.g. cable TV, do focus on this. Are we also playing dumb on the generational gap in technology, demographics using online media, and their ideaology?

cmh89 3y ago

That's quite a revisionist history. The early web was heavily moderated, just on a smaller scale. >Hate to say it, but once the tech elite ( or more like the money elite controlling tech ) started talking about minority, lgbt and women's 'rights', they all started censoring, deplatforming, oppressing. There's nothing stopping you from creating yet another "free speech" website. They typically fail because what the "tech elite" realize, along with most people, is that "free speech" websites devolve into people spamming racial slurs. Most people don't want to be around that. >Of course to fight 'hate speech' - whatever that means There is huge amounts of discourse on hate speech and what it means. There is plenty to read on the subject if you truly don't understand what it means. >It's like someone or some group flipped a switch and everyone from business to politics started singing a different tune. There was no switch. As the internet grew and became more diverse, the people who are typically the targets of hateful speech on the internet grew in their ability to influence companies. Back in the early 2000s, women avoided using a microphone because if they did, they would receive abuse or unwanted sexual comments. As the amount of women in video games increased, corporations become focused on the needs of their audience and how to make them feel welcome and buy more games. It's the same story for pretty much every other aspect of tech. What you're imagining as some conspiracy to "oppress" (lol) you because you can't spam racial slurs or spread race-based conspiracy theories is actually marketing executives realizing that catering to the extremely small "freeze peach" audience that wants to post odious content isn't an actual winning strategy for growing your business.

smolder 3y ago
Tangential, but, nowadays there are many digital spaces where saying "its not ok to hate cis white men" will get you a chorus of people saying "yes it is", followed by the boot.
- aaaaarrrrrfffff 3y ago
  Very tangential. Those sorts of spaces do exist, and likewise pockets of racism, homophobia, transphobia, and misogeny all exist too. Hating cis white men for existing isn't something that should be acceptable, and death threats are never okay. And there are stressors that they do face - the suffering of others does not invalidate your own. But at the same time, there are also plenty of spaces mocking and belittling trans people, gay people, black people, and women in general. Those places also spam death threats, only these death threats are a little more credible, a little more real, because there is a history of real, physical violence against all those demographics. At the same time, there are many people who just genuinely don't understand, who were sheltered by the previous generation's willful ignorance, who phrase their questions in a way that looks, at first glance, like another unprompted malicious attack. The violence is why those communities react so strongly to those questions, and why they are so hostile to what is, by all accounts, a reasonable statement. In more closed off digital spaces, where conversation is focused around issues common to those demographics, like the violence or discrimination they've experienced, it might come across as uncaring - if a trans woman is talking about how a cute guy she was talking to at a bar stalked her and tried to beat her after she mentioned that she is trans, and someone chooses that moment to say that it's not okay to hate cis white men, it just comes across as intentionally uncaring, as if that person saw all of the murder, rape, violence, hatred, and discrimination these people experience in daily life, then decided, "Nope, your attitude towards white cis men is the real problem here". Open spaces often use the same heuristic to determine if someone is acting in good faith, but due to being open this tends to catch a lot of people who aren't familiar with the heuristic at play, and only see a perfectly legitimate statement that seems to put everyone in a frenzy. Now this isn't to say that these communities don't take it too far on their own. There are some which engage in doxxing, death threats, and all sorts of terrible behavior, but those communities are not the whole majority, just as the racist, transphobic, misogynistic and homophobic groups aren't the whole of cis white men. In both cases, those groups simply are the loudest.

redeeman 3y ago

unfortunately it seems a great many tech people are cowards and just goes along with all the BS. They have to collect a paycheck after all.