4 ms·

> No matter what kind of broken state the computer was in, you could always start the Task Manager. The only thing that can prevent me from accessing htop, is

> No matter what kind of broken state the computer was in, you could always start the Task Manager. The only thing that can prevent me from accessing htop, is a kernel panic. Because, even if the Desktop Environment crashes or freezes (Can't even remember the last time that happened), I can always switch to another virtual console with Ctrl+Meta+F2, login and run any program from there, including starting another DE instance. And in the equivalent of a kernel panic in windows (BSOD), the Task Manager is inaccessible as well.

dzaima 3y ago
The thing that kills linux is being out of RAM (but, to my recollection, not at all Windows - worst-case there'd be a pop-up asking for which process to close (still a GUI! and giving a choice!!)). I lived for a long time with a linux mint system where full RAM meant that even a ctrl+alt+f2 login might take minutes to process, or even just time out. Maybe things are somewhat better now (I also have earlyoom installed) but out-of-memory still is an extremely significant annoyance at its absolute best. edit: disabled earlyoom & started a process that continuously allocates memory, still happens; ctrl+alt+f2 doesn't respond ever (DE ofc is frozen), and a htop over ssh gives a repaint every couple minutes if I'm lucky, but is useless; just rebooted via the physical reboot button after 30 minutes. Utterly unreasonable behavior.
- ylyn 3y ago
  The reason for this is that in Windows the DE is part of the system so it knows what to keep in memory. On Linux the DE and shell and htop is just another program so when the system is under high memory pressure those things also get swapped out and back in when they need to run. Thrashing. If you run something like memlockd to keep vital binaries from being swapped out I'm sure you will see that behaviour improve.
- TRiG_Ireland 3y ago
  Yes. I've been known to walk away from the computer to get dinner, and come back an hour or so later. Usually by then it's sorted itself out, but not always. Interestingly, Slack is always in a bad state after such a freeze, and needs to be forceably restarted, but everything else is fine. It's generally simpler just to force a reboot.

dzaima 3y ago

The thing that kills linux is being out of RAM (but, to my recollection, not at all Windows - worst-case there'd be a pop-up asking for which process to close (still a GUI! and giving a choice!!)). I lived for a long time with a linux mint system where full RAM meant that even a ctrl+alt+f2 login might take minutes to process, or even just time out. Maybe things are somewhat better now (I also have earlyoom installed) but out-of-memory still is an extremely significant annoyance at its absolute best. edit: disabled earlyoom & started a process that continuously allocates memory, still happens; ctrl+alt+f2 doesn't respond ever (DE ofc is frozen), and a htop over ssh gives a repaint every couple minutes if I'm lucky, but is useless; just rebooted via the physical reboot button after 30 minutes. Utterly unreasonable behavior.

ylyn 3y ago
The reason for this is that in Windows the DE is part of the system so it knows what to keep in memory. On Linux the DE and shell and htop is just another program so when the system is under high memory pressure those things also get swapped out and back in when they need to run. Thrashing. If you run something like memlockd to keep vital binaries from being swapped out I'm sure you will see that behaviour improve.
TRiG_Ireland 3y ago
Yes. I've been known to walk away from the computer to get dinner, and come back an hour or so later. Usually by then it's sorted itself out, but not always. Interestingly, Slack is always in a bad state after such a freeze, and needs to be forceably restarted, but everything else is fine. It's generally simpler just to force a reboot.