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> I don’t think you’ve ever been the level of our-of-shape that many people are. No, I haven't. And I fail to see how being out-of-shape is a comfort and not a

> I don’t think you’ve ever been the level of our-of-shape that many people are. No, I haven't. And I fail to see how being out-of-shape is a comfort and not a discomfort. I do agree that we can't force morbidly obese people onto bikes. But the narrative amongst healthy people has got to change that their life would be DRAMATICALLY worse if they biked instead of drove a stupid $80k SUV. Only ~28% of urbanites are obese in the US, btw. Compare that to ~60% in most rural areas and suburbs. In most walkable urban areas - this number is ~20% or less. It's almost as if the car and the design of our cities makes us fat, and maybe we should change that, instead of saying that the car & roads & parking makes us comfortable.

Paul-Craft 3y ago
What you are apparently failing to understand is that the Netherlands is smaller than the 41st largest of 50 states in the US (West Virginia). The longest distance you can travel by any means whatsoever in West Virginia is about 440km. Oh, and it has mountains, too. The Netherlands is pretty much flat, cyclist-friendly terrain. Let's also not forget that the US pretty much has no bike infrastructure. You can say "well, that's your fault," but it's not the fault of the SUV drivers; it's the fault of city planners who plan for anticipated demand by cyclists, rather than leading with infrastructure to encourage cycling. This predictably leads to a lack of people wanting to cycle, for fairly rational reasons: roads built for and dominated by cars are not very safe for people riding bikes. So, the demand doesn't materialize because the infrastructure isn't here, which inhibits demand. Oh, and yeah, the auto manufacturers had a bit to do with it as well. [0] In any case, your ire is aimed in the wrong direction, and the "fat, out of shape American" stereotype has very little to do with it. --- [0]: https://www.businessinsider.com/cycling-boom-us-streets-infrastructure-bike-lanes-history-united-states-2020-12?international=true&r=US&IR=T https://www.businessinsider.com/cycling-boom-us-streets-infr...
- onlyrealcuzzo 3y ago
  What you're failing to understand is I explicitly said this can work in urban areas. Netherlands doesn't have a huge biking culture in the middle of nowhere, Netherlands.
  - Paul-Craft 3y ago
    Please re-read my entire comment, as it is clear you skipped everything past the first sentence.

Paul-Craft 3y ago

What you are apparently failing to understand is that the Netherlands is smaller than the 41st largest of 50 states in the US (West Virginia). The longest distance you can travel by any means whatsoever in West Virginia is about 440km. Oh, and it has mountains, too. The Netherlands is pretty much flat, cyclist-friendly terrain. Let's also not forget that the US pretty much has no bike infrastructure. You can say "well, that's your fault," but it's not the fault of the SUV drivers; it's the fault of city planners who plan for anticipated demand by cyclists, rather than leading with infrastructure to encourage cycling. This predictably leads to a lack of people wanting to cycle, for fairly rational reasons: roads built for and dominated by cars are not very safe for people riding bikes. So, the demand doesn't materialize because the infrastructure isn't here, which inhibits demand. Oh, and yeah, the auto manufacturers had a bit to do with it as well. [0] In any case, your ire is aimed in the wrong direction, and the "fat, out of shape American" stereotype has very little to do with it. --- [0]: https://www.businessinsider.com/cycling-boom-us-streets-infrastructure-bike-lanes-history-united-states-2020-12?international=true&r=US&IR=T https://www.businessinsider.com/cycling-boom-us-streets-infr...

onlyrealcuzzo 3y ago
What you're failing to understand is I explicitly said this can work in urban areas. Netherlands doesn't have a huge biking culture in the middle of nowhere, Netherlands.
- Paul-Craft 3y ago
  Please re-read my entire comment, as it is clear you skipped everything past the first sentence.