6 ms·

I have some strong, contentious views on this that I'd like to subject to a good debate. I.e., "tell me why I'm wrong..." But I know HN isn't a great forum fo

I have some strong, contentious views on this that I'd like to subject to a good debate. I.e., "tell me why I'm wrong..." But I know HN isn't a great forum for emotional topics like that. Any suggestions for where I can have that kind of discussion online?

stemlord 3y ago
lesswrong.com maybe Hn is a great forum for it though, all things considered.
- spencerflem 3y ago
  I wish it wasn't though. I come here for tech news, if I want politics I talk with my friends. This place has some pretty frustrating opinions.
  - brvsft 3y ago
    Yep, like this one: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37141370 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37141370
    - spencerflem 3y ago
      Hence why i wish there was less politics here. They're bait for annoying comments, mine included. Me & u would both be happier if we didn't have to be frustrated by eachother
      - mistermann 3y ago
        Well I find great joy and fascination in what happened in the last 3 messages of this conversation.....it feels rather novel. Is the inverse of frustration fascination?
- tekla 3y ago
  HN is a tech worker bubble. It's a terrible forum for these kinds of topics
emmelaich 3y ago
As you say, not HN. Also not reddit, for different reasons. Maybe write something up in substack and push it on twitter. @mention Shellenberger and others?
mistermann 3y ago
I'd try https://www.themotte.org https://www.themotte.org, it's like /r/slatestarcodex with the training wheels removed.
- SilasX 3y ago
  And inability to opt out of the reddit redesign...
threeseed 3y ago
Twitter is unfortunately still the best place. But instead follow people who are involved in policy decisions, social workers, psychologists, housing advocates etc. As you will get a more nuanced look at some of the issues. Drug use and homelessness are two of the most complex problems in society to solve and usually require multi-faceted approaches across a wide array of disciplines to solve.
- simple-thoughts 3y ago
  Or, just enforce laws and follow the proven “broken windows theory” of policing. Which worked in cities such as NYC.
  - freedude 3y ago
    While the environment in which a person lives may dictate their value of their surroundings the real problem is a lack of hope. To further compound the lack of hope the local government has proven itself inept at solving the problems it is responsible to solve let alone the problems it is not responsible to resolve. That said it makes applying a "broken window" theory next to impossible. I do hope and pray they figure it out. For the sake of those on the street and the honest person that travels through there daily.
- jseliger 3y ago
  Drug use and homelessness are two of the most complex problems in society to solve Homelessness is not a complex problem to substantially ameliorate: https://seliger.com/2022/06/29/homelessness-is-a-housing-problem-when-cities-build-housing-homelessness-goes-down/ https://seliger.com/2022/06/29/homelessness-is-a-housing-pro.... Northern California has tried absolutely everything to reduce homelessness except building more housing: https://www.mcsweeneys.net/articles/i-will-do-anything-to-end-homelessness-except-build-more-homes https://www.mcsweeneys.net/articles/i-will-do-anything-to-en....
  - threeseed 3y ago
    Social housing does work but can be hard to do well. Places in London that built large scale apartment complexes for social housing saw them turned into slums with rampant drug use, violence and criminal activity. And it can be harder to get smaller-medium density housing to work because you're constantly fighting against local governments and NIMBY types.
whats_a_quasar 3y ago
You could try https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/ https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/. Not sure what the quality is like now but it had some interesting discussions in the 2010s
cscurmudgeon 3y ago
Any forum which is against diverse but calmly-presented views backed with data is not a good forum.
- cscurmudgeon 3y ago
  Hilarious that this is downvoted.
  - CoastalCoder 3y ago
    I didn't downvote your comment: > Any forum which is against diverse but calmly-presented views backed with data is not a good forum. but I do think it over-simplifies things. For example, I find HN to be a good forum for back-and-forth discussions about technical topics. But IMHO discussions involving ideology are far more likely to go off the rails.
    - cscurmudgeon 3y ago
      If it goes off the rails, it probably is not backed by data or logic.
lampshades 3y ago
I disagree. I've always found HN to be a great place to discuss things like this. In fact, HN sometimes feels like one of the only places I can discuss things like this without being downvoted to hell and back. Speak your mind.
- CoastalCoder 3y ago
  I appreciate the suggestion, but unfortunately my experience on HN has been the opposite. Heck, even my question, above is currently rated (at most) -2, for reasons I can't fathom.
Jevon23 3y ago
themotte.org

stemlord 3y ago

lesswrong.com maybe Hn is a great forum for it though, all things considered.

spencerflem 3y ago
I wish it wasn't though. I come here for tech news, if I want politics I talk with my friends. This place has some pretty frustrating opinions.
- brvsft 3y ago
  Yep, like this one: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37141370 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37141370
  - spencerflem 3y ago
    Hence why i wish there was less politics here. They're bait for annoying comments, mine included. Me & u would both be happier if we didn't have to be frustrated by eachother
    - mistermann 3y ago
      Well I find great joy and fascination in what happened in the last 3 messages of this conversation.....it feels rather novel. Is the inverse of frustration fascination?
tekla 3y ago
HN is a tech worker bubble. It's a terrible forum for these kinds of topics

emmelaich 3y ago

As you say, not HN. Also not reddit, for different reasons. Maybe write something up in substack and push it on twitter. @mention Shellenberger and others?

mistermann 3y ago

I'd try https://www.themotte.org https://www.themotte.org, it's like /r/slatestarcodex with the training wheels removed.

SilasX 3y ago
And inability to opt out of the reddit redesign...

threeseed 3y ago

Twitter is unfortunately still the best place. But instead follow people who are involved in policy decisions, social workers, psychologists, housing advocates etc. As you will get a more nuanced look at some of the issues. Drug use and homelessness are two of the most complex problems in society to solve and usually require multi-faceted approaches across a wide array of disciplines to solve.

simple-thoughts 3y ago
Or, just enforce laws and follow the proven “broken windows theory” of policing. Which worked in cities such as NYC.
- freedude 3y ago
  While the environment in which a person lives may dictate their value of their surroundings the real problem is a lack of hope. To further compound the lack of hope the local government has proven itself inept at solving the problems it is responsible to solve let alone the problems it is not responsible to resolve. That said it makes applying a "broken window" theory next to impossible. I do hope and pray they figure it out. For the sake of those on the street and the honest person that travels through there daily.
jseliger 3y ago
Drug use and homelessness are two of the most complex problems in society to solve Homelessness is not a complex problem to substantially ameliorate: https://seliger.com/2022/06/29/homelessness-is-a-housing-problem-when-cities-build-housing-homelessness-goes-down/ https://seliger.com/2022/06/29/homelessness-is-a-housing-pro.... Northern California has tried absolutely everything to reduce homelessness except building more housing: https://www.mcsweeneys.net/articles/i-will-do-anything-to-end-homelessness-except-build-more-homes https://www.mcsweeneys.net/articles/i-will-do-anything-to-en....
- threeseed 3y ago
  Social housing does work but can be hard to do well. Places in London that built large scale apartment complexes for social housing saw them turned into slums with rampant drug use, violence and criminal activity. And it can be harder to get smaller-medium density housing to work because you're constantly fighting against local governments and NIMBY types.

whats_a_quasar 3y ago

You could try https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/ https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/. Not sure what the quality is like now but it had some interesting discussions in the 2010s

cscurmudgeon 3y ago

Any forum which is against diverse but calmly-presented views backed with data is not a good forum.

cscurmudgeon 3y ago
Hilarious that this is downvoted.
- CoastalCoder 3y ago
  I didn't downvote your comment: > Any forum which is against diverse but calmly-presented views backed with data is not a good forum. but I do think it over-simplifies things. For example, I find HN to be a good forum for back-and-forth discussions about technical topics. But IMHO discussions involving ideology are far more likely to go off the rails.
  - cscurmudgeon 3y ago
    If it goes off the rails, it probably is not backed by data or logic.

lampshades 3y ago

I disagree. I've always found HN to be a great place to discuss things like this. In fact, HN sometimes feels like one of the only places I can discuss things like this without being downvoted to hell and back. Speak your mind.

CoastalCoder 3y ago
I appreciate the suggestion, but unfortunately my experience on HN has been the opposite. Heck, even my question, above is currently rated (at most) -2, for reasons I can't fathom.

Jevon23 3y ago

themotte.org