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> The way I see it, it's only the people who don't have concentration camps that have the moral standing to complain about them. Well, no. If the American peop

> The way I see it, it's only the people who don't have concentration camps that have the moral standing to complain about them. Well, no. If the American people doesn't want to partner with China because 1-3 millions in camps is too much to stomach for them (remember, they only had 700 people and it already was a huge problem for them) and they want to complain about it and maybe this could lead to force China to reassess the situation ? There's a better chance of things moving in the right direction with the US complaining than with Luxembourg or San Marino. I doubt disqualifying that course of action because of some absolutist Sith moral has ever been known to change things for the better. > You don't get to play "do as I say not as I do" on the world stage and the US should be laughed off it when it tries (this is happening more and more). That is the cost we pay for being evil. Yeah, and yet they still do. It's a process. There are backward steps and forward steps. The country recognizing it has a concentration camp problem of 30 people today is much further on the right path than the country denying it has a 1.8million concentration camp population problem. If it can call out the other's bigger bullshit and drag them along further on the right path then it's a good thing.

willcipriano 3y ago
> Well, no. If the American people doesn't want to partner with China because 1-3 millions in camps is too much to stomach That's the part you are missing. American politicians including the president and his family receive millions from China. US businesses, including Hollywood seem quite happy to deal with China and bend over backwards for them. Hell, lots of products sold in the US are likely made in the very labor camps they are complaining about. > There are backward steps and forward steps. That would be fine if the people behind the backward step weren't still in charge. We cant claimed to have learned anything if we can't even bother to replace a few elderly politicians who voted for a couple decades of war crimes.
- johnchristopher 3y ago
  Doesn't matter. Complaining about it is still the right thing to do. All your outlook achieves is forbidding criticism of evil. > We cant claimed to have learned anything if we can't even bother to replace a few elderly politicians who voted for a couple decades of war crimes. That's unrelated to the matter at hands and what is being discussed: Guantanamo is not comparable to the scale of Chinese concentration camps.
  - willcipriano 3y ago
    > Guantanamo is not comparable to the scale of Chinese concentration camps. Evil of that sort is a boolean not a scale. You are either the sort of people who do it or you aren't. You don't go to heaven even if your neighbor kept a million times as many slaves as you did.
    - johnchristopher 3y ago
      > > Guantanamo is not comparable to the scale of Chinese concentration camps. > Evil of that sort is a boolean not a scale. You are either the sort of people who do it or you aren't. You are conflating the scales of evil and the people responsible for it. Identical crimes often carry different sentences because of the patterns and the context: For how long ? Why ? How many victims ? Etc. Yes, the US have Guantanamo. Is it equivalent to China ? Definitely not. Are you championing the censuring of criticisms under the pretense of morals ? Most likely. Does your argument boil down to whataboutism ? Definitely. > You don't go to heaven even if your neighbor kept a million times as many slaves as you did. I am not fighting analogies and I am not living in a black and white world. You deal in absolutes and frankly that's not a stimulating conversation to have and certainly not a general outlook I can agree with.

willcipriano 3y ago

> Well, no. If the American people doesn't want to partner with China because 1-3 millions in camps is too much to stomach That's the part you are missing. American politicians including the president and his family receive millions from China. US businesses, including Hollywood seem quite happy to deal with China and bend over backwards for them. Hell, lots of products sold in the US are likely made in the very labor camps they are complaining about. > There are backward steps and forward steps. That would be fine if the people behind the backward step weren't still in charge. We cant claimed to have learned anything if we can't even bother to replace a few elderly politicians who voted for a couple decades of war crimes.

johnchristopher 3y ago
Doesn't matter. Complaining about it is still the right thing to do. All your outlook achieves is forbidding criticism of evil. > We cant claimed to have learned anything if we can't even bother to replace a few elderly politicians who voted for a couple decades of war crimes. That's unrelated to the matter at hands and what is being discussed: Guantanamo is not comparable to the scale of Chinese concentration camps.
- willcipriano 3y ago
  > Guantanamo is not comparable to the scale of Chinese concentration camps. Evil of that sort is a boolean not a scale. You are either the sort of people who do it or you aren't. You don't go to heaven even if your neighbor kept a million times as many slaves as you did.
  - johnchristopher 3y ago
    > > Guantanamo is not comparable to the scale of Chinese concentration camps. > Evil of that sort is a boolean not a scale. You are either the sort of people who do it or you aren't. You are conflating the scales of evil and the people responsible for it. Identical crimes often carry different sentences because of the patterns and the context: For how long ? Why ? How many victims ? Etc. Yes, the US have Guantanamo. Is it equivalent to China ? Definitely not. Are you championing the censuring of criticisms under the pretense of morals ? Most likely. Does your argument boil down to whataboutism ? Definitely. > You don't go to heaven even if your neighbor kept a million times as many slaves as you did. I am not fighting analogies and I am not living in a black and white world. You deal in absolutes and frankly that's not a stimulating conversation to have and certainly not a general outlook I can agree with.