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German manufacturing output is 90% higher than it was 20 years ago. Your worldview is seriously askew.

by derriz 3y ago

CamperBob2 3y ago
Was that accomplished by building and shipping 90% more product, or by redefining the term "manufacturing business?"
- derriz 3y ago
  The former. "Manufacturing output" is a standard statistic, like GDP, used for global comparison and historical comparison so how it's measured is defined by the OECD.
  - fwungy 3y ago
    Yes, and if we all go burn our houses down the GDP increases became we create more economic activity. The point being the statistics don't necessarily mean what you'd think they mean, and they do redefine/game them when they want.
    - signatoremo 3y ago
      Did Germany do it in this case? Maybe present source instead of vaguely claiming they did?
    - derriz 3y ago
      And? I don't get the reliance of this at all? I'm responding to the suggestion that Germany doctored the numbers regarding manufacturing output. I found this suggestion weird but I've tried to respond with a straight answer and not assume anything about the agenda behind the question. This was maybe a mistake. The OECD defines how "manufacturing output" is measured. The same method is used to measure manufacturing output in every OECD country and has been used for over 50 years. Germany was the 4th biggest manufacturer in the world in 1970 and it's still the 4th biggest manufacturer in the world. Why is this so difficult to believe or preposterous? Look it up, google it, read some wikipedia, look at secondary economic indicators, employment numbers, everything, there is ZERO evidence of a collapse in German manufacturing anywhere.
    - fwungy 3y ago
      It was just so obviously stupid. I don't have time to wade through German government websites finding the trail. Modern civilization, like in Germany, requires a certain per capita level of energy resources. If you increase the cost of energy without a matching increase in economic resources you lose functionality in your infrastructure. Germany willfully chose to cut domestic energy production and increase its own costs. Now its core manufacturing is crumbling. BASF, for example, is relocating to China[0]. They claim they're using 100% renewable energy there, but such claims are easy to make in China and hard to verify. The Western sustainable energy policy is like watching a man hit himself repeatedly in the head with a hammer and then wonder why he has a headache. [0]https://www.basf.com/cn/en/media/news-releases/cn/2022/09/BASF_first_plant_Zhanjiang_Verbund_site.html https://www.basf.com/cn/en/media/news-releases/cn/2022/09/BA...

German manufacturing output is 90% higher than it was 20 years ago. Your worldview is seriously askew.

by derriz 3y ago

German manufacturing output is 90% higher than it was 20 years ago. Your worldview is seriously askew.

CamperBob2 3y ago

Was that accomplished by building and shipping 90% more product, or by redefining the term "manufacturing business?"

derriz 3y ago
The former. "Manufacturing output" is a standard statistic, like GDP, used for global comparison and historical comparison so how it's measured is defined by the OECD.
- fwungy 3y ago
  Yes, and if we all go burn our houses down the GDP increases became we create more economic activity. The point being the statistics don't necessarily mean what you'd think they mean, and they do redefine/game them when they want.
  - signatoremo 3y ago
    Did Germany do it in this case? Maybe present source instead of vaguely claiming they did?
  - derriz 3y ago
    And? I don't get the reliance of this at all? I'm responding to the suggestion that Germany doctored the numbers regarding manufacturing output. I found this suggestion weird but I've tried to respond with a straight answer and not assume anything about the agenda behind the question. This was maybe a mistake. The OECD defines how "manufacturing output" is measured. The same method is used to measure manufacturing output in every OECD country and has been used for over 50 years. Germany was the 4th biggest manufacturer in the world in 1970 and it's still the 4th biggest manufacturer in the world. Why is this so difficult to believe or preposterous? Look it up, google it, read some wikipedia, look at secondary economic indicators, employment numbers, everything, there is ZERO evidence of a collapse in German manufacturing anywhere.
  - fwungy 3y ago
    It was just so obviously stupid. I don't have time to wade through German government websites finding the trail. Modern civilization, like in Germany, requires a certain per capita level of energy resources. If you increase the cost of energy without a matching increase in economic resources you lose functionality in your infrastructure. Germany willfully chose to cut domestic energy production and increase its own costs. Now its core manufacturing is crumbling. BASF, for example, is relocating to China[0]. They claim they're using 100% renewable energy there, but such claims are easy to make in China and hard to verify. The Western sustainable energy policy is like watching a man hit himself repeatedly in the head with a hammer and then wonder why he has a headache. [0]https://www.basf.com/cn/en/media/news-releases/cn/2022/09/BASF_first_plant_Zhanjiang_Verbund_site.html https://www.basf.com/cn/en/media/news-releases/cn/2022/09/BA...