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Speaking as a parent, the state of higher education is shocking. Costs of $300,000 for a 4-year degree ($75K/year for tuition, fees, and housing) is not just p

by agar 3y ago

Speaking as a parent, the state of higher education is shocking. Costs of $300,000 for a 4-year degree ($75K/year for tuition, fees, and housing) is not just possible, it's essentially the norm for many schools that aren't even top-tier. Even state schools will run about $200,000, all-in. God forbid you have more than one child. Universities tout their need-based financial aid, but the cut off is often far below the median salary in high cost of living areas. At that point the aid is "Congratulations, you qualify for student loans!" It's great that more lower-income families can get a full scholarship, but the middle class has been priced out of everything but state schools and community college.

ecshafer 3y ago
In 2008 the “expensive universities” were $40-45k a year all in. Now they are $80k a year all in. Outside of computer science, high finance, and management consulting… who is paying enough to warrant a $320k degree? And even then it’s pushing it…
- agar 3y ago
  This is exactly right. It also forces 18 year-olds to commit to a high $ major on day 1, then stick with it no matter what. What if you're undecided, but still want to be in a good university while you figure it out? What if you realize you hate computer science but don't want to transfer universities? These would be horrible causes of anxiety, stress, and burn-out.
jimbob45 3y ago
Are you citing in-state or out-of-state figures?
- agar 3y ago
  The most costly, of course, are private schools (which is where my daughter wants to go). However, the "financial back-up plan" of in-state 4-year universities is not exactly affordable either. In-state cost of UCLA, for example, is $37,385. UC Davis is $38,956 for California residents.
TexanFeller 3y ago
In my state UT is highly ranked nationally for many programs and estimated costs are $33k/yr to study engineering, or $130k total(source: https://admissions.utexas.edu/cost-aid/cost-tuition-rates/ https://admissions.utexas.edu/cost-aid/cost-tuition-rates/). That's for a great school in one of the most expensive cities in the state. The largest component of that is $13k living expenses which you would spend anyway if not attending. If you want lower living costs you can attend a non-prestigious university in a smaller town like I did with lower tuition and noticeably lower living costs. Combine this with taking AP classes and CLEP tests in high school and using community college in the summer for the worthless "common core" college credits and the savings are much larger. You don't have to spend $200k!
- agar 3y ago
  Of course there are options; there's community college, transferring, less prestigious schools, etc. However, it sucks to tell your kid that worked their ass off their whole life that they can't go to their first choice schools because of administrative mismanagement. Read the WSJ article that is linked elsewhere to see the systemic issues facing higher education. It's bleak. "Congratulations, you got into Rice! Can I interest you in University of North Texas instead?"
  - nunez 3y ago
    UNT has a world-class music program, so maybe?
  - TexanFeller 3y ago
    Welcome to life for most of us. Precious few are privileged enough to go to whatever school they want to. Almost everyone has to make tradeoffs based on economic factors, it's been that way forever. It was that way over two decades ago when I went to school. I dreamed of going to MIT or more realistically UT, but that wasn't affordable to me with the support my family struggled to provide. I took all the measures I suggested, lived first 1hr away at home and then in a trailer park instead of on campus, and worked as much as I could between classes. A big chunk of my classmates were worse off. UNT has some perfectly good programs by the way, some of the most brilliant and successful people I know graduated from their math and physics programs.

by agar 3y ago

ecshafer 3y ago

In 2008 the “expensive universities” were $40-45k a year all in. Now they are $80k a year all in. Outside of computer science, high finance, and management consulting… who is paying enough to warrant a $320k degree? And even then it’s pushing it…

agar 3y ago
This is exactly right. It also forces 18 year-olds to commit to a high $ major on day 1, then stick with it no matter what. What if you're undecided, but still want to be in a good university while you figure it out? What if you realize you hate computer science but don't want to transfer universities? These would be horrible causes of anxiety, stress, and burn-out.

jimbob45 3y ago

Are you citing in-state or out-of-state figures?

agar 3y ago
The most costly, of course, are private schools (which is where my daughter wants to go). However, the "financial back-up plan" of in-state 4-year universities is not exactly affordable either. In-state cost of UCLA, for example, is $37,385. UC Davis is $38,956 for California residents.

TexanFeller 3y ago

In my state UT is highly ranked nationally for many programs and estimated costs are $33k/yr to study engineering, or $130k total(source: https://admissions.utexas.edu/cost-aid/cost-tuition-rates/ https://admissions.utexas.edu/cost-aid/cost-tuition-rates/). That's for a great school in one of the most expensive cities in the state. The largest component of that is $13k living expenses which you would spend anyway if not attending. If you want lower living costs you can attend a non-prestigious university in a smaller town like I did with lower tuition and noticeably lower living costs. Combine this with taking AP classes and CLEP tests in high school and using community college in the summer for the worthless "common core" college credits and the savings are much larger. You don't have to spend $200k!

agar 3y ago
Of course there are options; there's community college, transferring, less prestigious schools, etc. However, it sucks to tell your kid that worked their ass off their whole life that they can't go to their first choice schools because of administrative mismanagement. Read the WSJ article that is linked elsewhere to see the systemic issues facing higher education. It's bleak. "Congratulations, you got into Rice! Can I interest you in University of North Texas instead?"
- nunez 3y ago
  UNT has a world-class music program, so maybe?
- TexanFeller 3y ago
  Welcome to life for most of us. Precious few are privileged enough to go to whatever school they want to. Almost everyone has to make tradeoffs based on economic factors, it's been that way forever. It was that way over two decades ago when I went to school. I dreamed of going to MIT or more realistically UT, but that wasn't affordable to me with the support my family struggled to provide. I took all the measures I suggested, lived first 1hr away at home and then in a trailer park instead of on campus, and worked as much as I could between classes. A big chunk of my classmates were worse off. UNT has some perfectly good programs by the way, some of the most brilliant and successful people I know graduated from their math and physics programs.