3 ms·

> internally consistent limits on what the player can know Interesting thought. Can you expand? What do you mean by this?

by ijidak 3y ago

r2_pilot 3y ago
Not the original author but my first interpretation is that this means, if it were in a video game, it would be a way to self-reinforce "fog of war" where you can only have extremely local information and you don't want extra information to leak to the players.
- JumpCrisscross 3y ago
  Has anyone re-written a classic RTSG with a slower speed of light? Like, Red Alert, but with time dilation.
  - r2_pilot 3y ago
    Not to my knowledge, but there is a game called A Slower Speed of Light, which probably needs no further clarification. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Slower_Speed_of_Light https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Slower_Speed_of_Light
  - mekkkkkk 3y ago
    Wouldn't that be incredibly hard, considering that the players perspective is disconnected from the units? I observe my base and order a group of units to go to some place on the minimap. I see them moving along on their way, and decide to scroll to them. Only to realize that they already arrived and got massacred by the enemy. I go back to my base only to realize that it was destroyed ages ago (in its frame of reference) and I'm dead. Game over. Thanks for playing SR Red Alert.
    - vient 3y ago
      In ordinary strategies you already have an assumption of immediate information transfer from unit to player - you see what each unit is seeing. This can be kept so you will see you units moving in real time but as things get further from your units on the map, the older info about them you get.
      - mekkkkkk 3y ago
        That's interesting. Wouldn't it lead to paradoxes where enemy units are shown at multiple places at once, observed from different frames of reference? Would be incredibly confusing, but confusing games can be fun too. EDIT: Also if a unit traveled close to C away from a friendly unit, and then back, whos reference is real?
        vient 3y ago
        Observations merging is interesting question. Simplest thing to do may be to show enemy unit as it is seen by our unit closest to them (here we just use "real" distance in internal game's coordinates). In other words, Voronoi diagram is built with our units as seeds, and enemies are shown as seen from their cell center. This would evade enemy "phantoms" but enemies can suddenly "teleport" as they move closer to other friendly unit (or can't they? I don't really know). In lore it may be explained like "our units know distances to objects and choose closest one among all units" since we already use "units can communicate instantly" magic.
    - xwdv 3y ago
      Would be great as an artistic project, maybe not as a game. Also in time I bet some players would find ways to win reliably, creating a new field of military strategy.
    - JumpCrisscross 3y ago
      You’d have to have a HQ relative to which all dilation is calculated. If done correctly, it could simplify server operations since the need for simultaneity is relaxed.
  - AnimalMuppet 3y ago
    I don't know about an RTSG, but I have seen it in a novel: Redshift Rendezvous.
- jancsika 3y ago
  Wouldn't it be slightly easier to just, you know, visually obscure the opponent's base?
javajosh 3y ago
Sure. I expanded in another comment: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37128472 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37128472

> internally consistent limits on what the player can know Interesting thought. Can you expand? What do you mean by this?

by ijidak 3y ago

> internally consistent limits on what the player can know Interesting thought. Can you expand? What do you mean by this?

r2_pilot 3y ago

Not the original author but my first interpretation is that this means, if it were in a video game, it would be a way to self-reinforce "fog of war" where you can only have extremely local information and you don't want extra information to leak to the players.

JumpCrisscross 3y ago
Has anyone re-written a classic RTSG with a slower speed of light? Like, Red Alert, but with time dilation.
- r2_pilot 3y ago
  Not to my knowledge, but there is a game called A Slower Speed of Light, which probably needs no further clarification. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Slower_Speed_of_Light https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Slower_Speed_of_Light
- mekkkkkk 3y ago
  Wouldn't that be incredibly hard, considering that the players perspective is disconnected from the units? I observe my base and order a group of units to go to some place on the minimap. I see them moving along on their way, and decide to scroll to them. Only to realize that they already arrived and got massacred by the enemy. I go back to my base only to realize that it was destroyed ages ago (in its frame of reference) and I'm dead. Game over. Thanks for playing SR Red Alert.
  - vient 3y ago
    In ordinary strategies you already have an assumption of immediate information transfer from unit to player - you see what each unit is seeing. This can be kept so you will see you units moving in real time but as things get further from your units on the map, the older info about them you get.
    - mekkkkkk 3y ago
      That's interesting. Wouldn't it lead to paradoxes where enemy units are shown at multiple places at once, observed from different frames of reference? Would be incredibly confusing, but confusing games can be fun too. EDIT: Also if a unit traveled close to C away from a friendly unit, and then back, whos reference is real?
      - vient 3y ago
        Observations merging is interesting question. Simplest thing to do may be to show enemy unit as it is seen by our unit closest to them (here we just use "real" distance in internal game's coordinates). In other words, Voronoi diagram is built with our units as seeds, and enemies are shown as seen from their cell center. This would evade enemy "phantoms" but enemies can suddenly "teleport" as they move closer to other friendly unit (or can't they? I don't really know). In lore it may be explained like "our units know distances to objects and choose closest one among all units" since we already use "units can communicate instantly" magic.
  - xwdv 3y ago
    Would be great as an artistic project, maybe not as a game. Also in time I bet some players would find ways to win reliably, creating a new field of military strategy.
  - JumpCrisscross 3y ago
    You’d have to have a HQ relative to which all dilation is calculated. If done correctly, it could simplify server operations since the need for simultaneity is relaxed.
- AnimalMuppet 3y ago
  I don't know about an RTSG, but I have seen it in a novel: Redshift Rendezvous.
jancsika 3y ago
Wouldn't it be slightly easier to just, you know, visually obscure the opponent's base?

javajosh 3y ago

Sure. I expanded in another comment: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37128472 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37128472