3 ms·

I think it's clear the market is... "struggling" unless you're a senior dev who has 8+ years exp.

PartiallyTyped 3y ago
There have been comments here from 8+ engineers who are struggling. I guess that’s survivorship bias; but I don’t think it’s a guarantee.
revlolz 3y ago
Perhaps, I think there are a couple of things contributing to the declines represented since mid 2022. I believe them to be economic conditions. My outlook is quite the opposite as I think data roles will continue to grow in demand over time for the next 3 years. The overall economy is not doing well right now, at least in the USA. There is significant amount of extra talent (supply) on the market due to big tech hiring freezes and layoffs, which also contributes to lower demand of new roles. There is the return to office debacles occurring all the while housing is becoming even more unaffordable due to high interest rates (compared to the recent 2 to 3% during covid) and low supply a consequence of the rates where owners aren't going to want to trade a 2 to 4% for 7+ nearly 8% right now. I don't cite rto debacles to have a debate on the specifics of if rto is good/bad, but I would speculate that it's pushing more talent onto the job market to escape working environments forcing any style (rto or forced remote) that an employee disagrees with. So, in my mind the only thing my speculation doesn't really cover is how that would contribute to lower HN responses to which I don't have an answer, maybe it truly is shrinking. However, my gut says it's the economic factors. I think (and hope) that the shift in conditions occurs in the next 6 months and hiring ramps back up as companies recover and adapt.
robertlagrant 3y ago
This is only helpful as context, but you need to have had quite a few years' experience to remember before the era of cheap money and massive FAANG-inflated salaries. Now FAANG is getting significantly regulated and fined, and money is more expensive, things will no doubt start to cool off from a salary perspective.
rpastuszak 3y ago
It's much easier to find any job as a senior dev. It's almost impossible to find a genuinely useful job there, regardless of experience.

There have been comments here from 8+ engineers who are struggling. I guess that’s survivorship bias; but I don’t think it’s a guarantee.

revlolz 3y ago

Perhaps, I think there are a couple of things contributing to the declines represented since mid 2022. I believe them to be economic conditions. My outlook is quite the opposite as I think data roles will continue to grow in demand over time for the next 3 years. The overall economy is not doing well right now, at least in the USA. There is significant amount of extra talent (supply) on the market due to big tech hiring freezes and layoffs, which also contributes to lower demand of new roles. There is the return to office debacles occurring all the while housing is becoming even more unaffordable due to high interest rates (compared to the recent 2 to 3% during covid) and low supply a consequence of the rates where owners aren't going to want to trade a 2 to 4% for 7+ nearly 8% right now. I don't cite rto debacles to have a debate on the specifics of if rto is good/bad, but I would speculate that it's pushing more talent onto the job market to escape working environments forcing any style (rto or forced remote) that an employee disagrees with. So, in my mind the only thing my speculation doesn't really cover is how that would contribute to lower HN responses to which I don't have an answer, maybe it truly is shrinking. However, my gut says it's the economic factors. I think (and hope) that the shift in conditions occurs in the next 6 months and hiring ramps back up as companies recover and adapt.

robertlagrant 3y ago

This is only helpful as context, but you need to have had quite a few years' experience to remember before the era of cheap money and massive FAANG-inflated salaries. Now FAANG is getting significantly regulated and fined, and money is more expensive, things will no doubt start to cool off from a salary perspective.

rpastuszak 3y ago

It's much easier to find any job as a senior dev. It's almost impossible to find a genuinely useful job there, regardless of experience.