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> And since C++ is a superset of C that is certainly true there. C++ is not a superset of C. C99 has and C++ (at the time of writing) doesn't have: restricted

> And since C++ is a superset of C that is certainly true there. C++ is not a superset of C. C99 has and C++ (at the time of writing) doesn't have: restricted pointers, designated initializers, variable length arrays, and probably more. These are language features that are actually used. This doesn't change any of your core points.

patrick451 3y ago
C++ has had designated initializers since c++20.
- turndown 3y ago
  Any look into this will show that C's designated initializers are significantly more flexible/better in every way.
  - SubjectToChange 3y ago
    It’s amusing to me that whenever C has a feature that C++ doesn’t, C programmers hammer on the usefulness and power of said feature, but on the converse those same C programmers hammer on the divine simplicity of C. C++ has constructors, it doesn’t really need designated initializers in the first place. They were added primarily for C compatibility.
- kaashif 3y ago
  Point taken, I was inaccurate. Out of order designated initializers still don't work in C++20, right? Which still means C++ isn't a superset of C.
ftaghn 3y ago
> variable length arrays It was such a terrible feature it was made optional in the C11 standard (you can be a conforming C11 compiler and not allow this feature) and will never, ever be implemented in a Microsoft compiler (while C is not a priority for MS, do note that they updated to C11 and C17). You can hear their reasoning there : https://devblogs.microsoft.com/cppblog/c11-and-c17-standard-support-arriving-in-msvc/ https://devblogs.microsoft.com/cppblog/c11-and-c17-standard-... The linux kernel used to make use of the feature and removed every instance of it from the code base : https://www.phoronix.com/news/Linux-Kills-The-VLA https://www.phoronix.com/news/Linux-Kills-The-VLA > Particularly over the past several cycles there has been code eliminating the kernel's usage of VLAs and that has continued so far for this Linux 4.20~5.0 cycle. There had been more than 200 spots in the kernel relying upon VLAs but now as of the latest Linux Git code it should be basically over. While I do agree that it is wrong to consider C++ a superset of C, it is time to forget about C99's biggest mistake and treat it as if it didn't happen.
- kaashif 3y ago
  Agreed completely on all counts. Never ever use VLAs. My point is really just semantic, the overall argument I was responding to is intact.

patrick451 3y ago

C++ has had designated initializers since c++20.

turndown 3y ago
Any look into this will show that C's designated initializers are significantly more flexible/better in every way.
- SubjectToChange 3y ago
  It’s amusing to me that whenever C has a feature that C++ doesn’t, C programmers hammer on the usefulness and power of said feature, but on the converse those same C programmers hammer on the divine simplicity of C. C++ has constructors, it doesn’t really need designated initializers in the first place. They were added primarily for C compatibility.
kaashif 3y ago
Point taken, I was inaccurate. Out of order designated initializers still don't work in C++20, right? Which still means C++ isn't a superset of C.

ftaghn 3y ago

> variable length arrays It was such a terrible feature it was made optional in the C11 standard (you can be a conforming C11 compiler and not allow this feature) and will never, ever be implemented in a Microsoft compiler (while C is not a priority for MS, do note that they updated to C11 and C17). You can hear their reasoning there : https://devblogs.microsoft.com/cppblog/c11-and-c17-standard-support-arriving-in-msvc/ https://devblogs.microsoft.com/cppblog/c11-and-c17-standard-... The linux kernel used to make use of the feature and removed every instance of it from the code base : https://www.phoronix.com/news/Linux-Kills-The-VLA https://www.phoronix.com/news/Linux-Kills-The-VLA > Particularly over the past several cycles there has been code eliminating the kernel's usage of VLAs and that has continued so far for this Linux 4.20~5.0 cycle. There had been more than 200 spots in the kernel relying upon VLAs but now as of the latest Linux Git code it should be basically over. While I do agree that it is wrong to consider C++ a superset of C, it is time to forget about C99's biggest mistake and treat it as if it didn't happen.

kaashif 3y ago
Agreed completely on all counts. Never ever use VLAs. My point is really just semantic, the overall argument I was responding to is intact.