3 ms·

> dealing with an (edit: occasionally?) abusive parent. Its unfounded to call their parent abusive without more information

tough 3y ago
Psychologically? I dunno man, if you as a kid have to come up with strategies to -not piss off- your dad during -normal- regular conversation, maybe there's an issue there? Maybe the dad had some issues too, who knows
- brookst 3y ago
  I think it’s just semantics of whether “abuse” requires intent. If yes, then the commenters parent was probably not abusive. If not and only the behavior matters without regard for intent or psychology, then it does seem abusive.
  - danparsonson 3y ago
    For what it's worth, I am certainly in the second camp - in general (without reference to this specific example), it's certainly possible for people to behave abusively towards others without even realising that they're doing it. One can be responding to internal pressures without thought for how those responses affect those around them.
    - tough 3y ago
      Obliviousness to how your actions affect others do not make those actions disappear.
      - danparsonson 3y ago
        Yes that's my point - behaviour can be abusive regardless of whether or not the perpetrator intended or even noticed it.
        tough 3y ago
        Yes I was agreeing with you. Im on your camp.
- at_a_remove 3y ago
  I will go further: If someone cannot wait until the completion of a sentence to get ticked off, they have problems.
danparsonson 3y ago
You're right that I am responding to very limited information, and of course everyone is fully at liberty to ignore my opinion. That said, how would you describe a person (particularly a caregiver) who causes others to walk on eggshells because of their random unfounded outbursts, and refuses to back down when given reasonable explanations for the things they have become upset about? And not just once or twice but often enough that it has had a measurable effect on OP's behaviour. That sounds abusive to me. Again though, as you pointed out, it's not appropriate for me to continue to speculate on this; I just wanted to elaborate on my original comment to make clear my reasoning.
- ilyt 3y ago
  "A man that doesn't want his kid to get into alcohol/drugs and worries too much" ? That's pretty far from abusive
  - danparsonson 3y ago
    [flagged]
    - lifeisstillgood 3y ago
      I think it's worth mentioning that you seem to be in an argument that I see again and again. I am mostly on your side here - it is not for the child to work around the parent and this is a sea chnage in (western?) psychology that is filtering through to even idiots like me. And yea it is part of the culture war we are (always) going through. So yes, we need to up the game on parenting and personal responsibility- it's going to be a tough ride as we find out just how bad most of our families are - but the upside is good too. However I think we need to also find different words - abuse is a strong term. And most of the reaction I think you are getting here is reaction to specific words as opposed to your philosophy
      - danparsonson 3y ago
        Thank you, yes I think you're right - an unfortunate choice of word on my part it seems.
porknubbins 3y ago
If you had the same type of parent you can read between the lines (possibly wrongly but its better to be over sensitized than miss it) to see the narcissism or abuse. A stable parent would say “I trust my child who I raised and will hear the whole story”, while the abuse parent is having some kind of fear or anger response triggered that is all about them and their emotions and they kind of stop paying attention to whatever else you say.
- danparsonson 3y ago
  Indeed. Some things that education and hindsight has made obvious, can be impossible to see when they are all around, and even for years afterwards.

tough 3y ago

Psychologically? I dunno man, if you as a kid have to come up with strategies to -not piss off- your dad during -normal- regular conversation, maybe there's an issue there? Maybe the dad had some issues too, who knows

brookst 3y ago
I think it’s just semantics of whether “abuse” requires intent. If yes, then the commenters parent was probably not abusive. If not and only the behavior matters without regard for intent or psychology, then it does seem abusive.
- danparsonson 3y ago
  For what it's worth, I am certainly in the second camp - in general (without reference to this specific example), it's certainly possible for people to behave abusively towards others without even realising that they're doing it. One can be responding to internal pressures without thought for how those responses affect those around them.
  - tough 3y ago
    Obliviousness to how your actions affect others do not make those actions disappear.
    - danparsonson 3y ago
      Yes that's my point - behaviour can be abusive regardless of whether or not the perpetrator intended or even noticed it.
      - tough 3y ago
        Yes I was agreeing with you. Im on your camp.
at_a_remove 3y ago
I will go further: If someone cannot wait until the completion of a sentence to get ticked off, they have problems.

danparsonson 3y ago

You're right that I am responding to very limited information, and of course everyone is fully at liberty to ignore my opinion. That said, how would you describe a person (particularly a caregiver) who causes others to walk on eggshells because of their random unfounded outbursts, and refuses to back down when given reasonable explanations for the things they have become upset about? And not just once or twice but often enough that it has had a measurable effect on OP's behaviour. That sounds abusive to me. Again though, as you pointed out, it's not appropriate for me to continue to speculate on this; I just wanted to elaborate on my original comment to make clear my reasoning.

ilyt 3y ago
"A man that doesn't want his kid to get into alcohol/drugs and worries too much" ? That's pretty far from abusive
- danparsonson 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - lifeisstillgood 3y ago
    I think it's worth mentioning that you seem to be in an argument that I see again and again. I am mostly on your side here - it is not for the child to work around the parent and this is a sea chnage in (western?) psychology that is filtering through to even idiots like me. And yea it is part of the culture war we are (always) going through. So yes, we need to up the game on parenting and personal responsibility- it's going to be a tough ride as we find out just how bad most of our families are - but the upside is good too. However I think we need to also find different words - abuse is a strong term. And most of the reaction I think you are getting here is reaction to specific words as opposed to your philosophy
    - danparsonson 3y ago
      Thank you, yes I think you're right - an unfortunate choice of word on my part it seems.

porknubbins 3y ago

If you had the same type of parent you can read between the lines (possibly wrongly but its better to be over sensitized than miss it) to see the narcissism or abuse. A stable parent would say “I trust my child who I raised and will hear the whole story”, while the abuse parent is having some kind of fear or anger response triggered that is all about them and their emotions and they kind of stop paying attention to whatever else you say.

danparsonson 3y ago
Indeed. Some things that education and hindsight has made obvious, can be impossible to see when they are all around, and even for years afterwards.