4 ms·

It's funny because when it's a black guy getting killed conservatives say it's their fault for getting killed for not complying. We've heard it endless times.

lionkor 3y ago
I'm not American so maybe I didn't get the memo, but isn't failing to comply multiple times one of the few legit reasons for violence by police?
- wodenokoto 3y ago
  Yes, that’s why the excuse exists. But it’s not like you can do anything to comply when the police is choking you to death.
- spywaregorilla 3y ago
  Measured violence, yes. In this case the guy was pointing a weapon at the police, so a killing feels justified imo.
- lincon127 3y ago
  Depends on context, obviously. The police officer has the responsibility to constantly assess the situation in order to determine if violence is warranted, as well as if that violence needs to be potentially lethal, regardless of whether or not a person is complying. As an office, one doesn't have the right to commit bodily harm, nevermind kill someone, without good cause. Hence why people talk about it so much, and also why people like to talk about police brutality even when it's regarding people that don't comply with officers (eg. protesters, bystanders, people filming, etc.) Example: this classic https://youtu.be/7Ooa7wOKHhg https://youtu.be/7Ooa7wOKHhg. Shit like this happens in the States all the time, it's just not usually as bad, nor televised. But situations with power mad cops crop up all the time. Cops that forget that they are an arm of the law, rather than the law itself. I don't know how the case mentioned in the article holds up though as I'm not aware of details.
- jfengel 3y ago
  The problem is that it seems to be applied inconsistently. It is a bitter joke among black Americans that the police shout "stop resisting!" whenever a racist cop wants to beat up a black person. We don't hear of nearly as many such incidents involving white people.
whome_ 3y ago
If someone kicks in your door in the middle of the night while you're asleep you may react in a way that isn't rational. I'm against forced entry no-knock raids unless a crime is in progress and lives are at stake. And I feel that way whether the homeowner is black, brown, white, or a space alien.
- spywaregorilla 3y ago
  I get what you're saying, but for what it's worth, trying to defend yourself against an unknown assailant breaking into your home in the middle of the night is rational. Firing a warning shot to establish a credible threat of violence if you happen to have a gun makes complete sense and probably the safest way to de-escalate what is an immediately dangerous situation. Because if the home assailant, if willing to engage in a firefight, was probably planning to just murder you anyway. We should not consider the guy to have acted inappropriately.
  - porkbeer 3y ago
    Warning shots are illegal, not to mention a terrible idea. Bullets go places, through walls, and fall if shot upwards. Knowing your target and what is beyond it, never shooting anything you dont intend to destroy ate the basics of gun safety. Please be careful talking confidently about things you are ignorant of.
    - spywaregorilla 3y ago
      Warning shots are not illegal when someone is breaking into your home in the middle of the night, as it is basically just a use of deadly force.
    - new7483037uu 3y ago
      Warning shots can safely be fired into the ground. If using a shotgun, which is probably the best choice for home defense, very little penetration through walls will occur. You won't accidentally hit someone on the street unless you shoot through a window.

lionkor 3y ago

I'm not American so maybe I didn't get the memo, but isn't failing to comply multiple times one of the few legit reasons for violence by police?

wodenokoto 3y ago
Yes, that’s why the excuse exists. But it’s not like you can do anything to comply when the police is choking you to death.
spywaregorilla 3y ago
Measured violence, yes. In this case the guy was pointing a weapon at the police, so a killing feels justified imo.
lincon127 3y ago
Depends on context, obviously. The police officer has the responsibility to constantly assess the situation in order to determine if violence is warranted, as well as if that violence needs to be potentially lethal, regardless of whether or not a person is complying. As an office, one doesn't have the right to commit bodily harm, nevermind kill someone, without good cause. Hence why people talk about it so much, and also why people like to talk about police brutality even when it's regarding people that don't comply with officers (eg. protesters, bystanders, people filming, etc.) Example: this classic https://youtu.be/7Ooa7wOKHhg https://youtu.be/7Ooa7wOKHhg. Shit like this happens in the States all the time, it's just not usually as bad, nor televised. But situations with power mad cops crop up all the time. Cops that forget that they are an arm of the law, rather than the law itself. I don't know how the case mentioned in the article holds up though as I'm not aware of details.
jfengel 3y ago
The problem is that it seems to be applied inconsistently. It is a bitter joke among black Americans that the police shout "stop resisting!" whenever a racist cop wants to beat up a black person. We don't hear of nearly as many such incidents involving white people.

whome_ 3y ago

If someone kicks in your door in the middle of the night while you're asleep you may react in a way that isn't rational. I'm against forced entry no-knock raids unless a crime is in progress and lives are at stake. And I feel that way whether the homeowner is black, brown, white, or a space alien.

spywaregorilla 3y ago
I get what you're saying, but for what it's worth, trying to defend yourself against an unknown assailant breaking into your home in the middle of the night is rational. Firing a warning shot to establish a credible threat of violence if you happen to have a gun makes complete sense and probably the safest way to de-escalate what is an immediately dangerous situation. Because if the home assailant, if willing to engage in a firefight, was probably planning to just murder you anyway. We should not consider the guy to have acted inappropriately.
- porkbeer 3y ago
  Warning shots are illegal, not to mention a terrible idea. Bullets go places, through walls, and fall if shot upwards. Knowing your target and what is beyond it, never shooting anything you dont intend to destroy ate the basics of gun safety. Please be careful talking confidently about things you are ignorant of.
  - spywaregorilla 3y ago
    Warning shots are not illegal when someone is breaking into your home in the middle of the night, as it is basically just a use of deadly force.
  - new7483037uu 3y ago
    Warning shots can safely be fired into the ground. If using a shotgun, which is probably the best choice for home defense, very little penetration through walls will occur. You won't accidentally hit someone on the street unless you shoot through a window.