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>Many otherwise intelligent people think that religion/philosophy is purely subjective, merely a word game Well, "subjective" is the wrong word, but I get what

>Many otherwise intelligent people think that religion/philosophy is purely subjective, merely a word game Well, "subjective" is the wrong word, but I get what you mean. However, aren't they just word games? It's not like theology and philosophy study anything real. They just investigate what can be deduced from specific axiomatic systems that are entirely divorced from reality. Theologians aren't even consistent, since they have dogmas that they'll contort around in order to avoid contradicting, even if that involves contradicting other parts of scripture. I'll never forget the time I asked a philosophy undergraduate why he decided to go to university for philosophy rather than just reading the bibliography by himself, and he told me that by doing so he could teach philosophy. An academic pyramid scheme.

maksimur 3y ago
Generally speaking university gives you the tools and guides you. Most of the people aren't able to study university level subjects on their own.
- bluescrn 3y ago
  That was the idea in the past. University now teaches you precisely what to think, and makes clear the consequences of ‘wrongthink’.
- deadbeeves 3y ago
  That might be the case for other disciplines, but it certainly isn't for philosophy. There are no special techniques, you just read what other people have said on the subject. What else is there?
  - jamilton 3y ago
    Discussions and having a peer group seems like it would be helpful for learning philosophy.
    - deadbeeves 3y ago
      Sure, but my question was about the purpose of studying philosophy in university. "It's easier than doing it by yourself" is not a purpose. There's still nothing you can do with what you've learned, other than become a professor.
      - travisjungroth 3y ago
        I just want to point out that you haven’t made a good argument for this to be true at all. One person does not make a pyramid scheme. Someone into cooking and teaching could go to culinary school and tell you their dream is to be a culinary instructor. Doesn’t make it a pyramid scheme. Philosophy has one of the highest average incomes of degrees, because of the number of graduates that go into law and business.
        deadbeeves 3y ago
        The implicit argument is that I don't see what else one could possibly do with a degree in philosophy. > Philosophy has one of the highest average incomes of degrees, because of the number of graduates that go into law and business. And why do they need those degrees in order to do that? What are they employed to do?
        travisjungroth 3y ago
        One thing you can do with a degree in philosophy is get into law school. After graduating from law school you can be employed as a lawyer. They’re not philosophy lawyers, just normal lawyers. This isn’t some fringe thing. Play around with some Google searches like “what can you do with a philosophy degree?”, “best pre-law degrees”, “philosophy and law school” and you will see what else one could possibly do with a degree in philosophy.
        deadbeeves 3y ago
        I didn't think I needed to specify "that you can't do without a philosophy degree". You can get into law school without a philosophy degree, too.
Aerbil313 3y ago
> It's not like theology and philosophy study anything real. That is a viewpoint. This is the exact fallacy pointed out upper in the thread. This is just a viewpoint of yours, however commonly held it may be in the society of today.
- deadbeeves 3y ago
  No, I'm not talking about something as banal as whether a god exists. I'm saying theology doesn't study anything real. It doesn't have the tools to determine whether a god exists, because it doesn't study reality, it studies scripture. That's not a point of view, that's what theology is. Regardless of whether magic exists, I think we can both agree we can't find out by reading Harry Potter. The same for philosophy. I like to half joke that modern philosophy is what's left after taking out all the useful parts of ancient natural philosophy and putting them into either mathematics or science.
  - edgyquant 3y ago
    If you think this way you must also think lawyers don’t study anything real because they study laws.
    - deadbeeves 3y ago
      It's not really an apt analogy. Law is not a field of inquiry like science, philosophy, mathematics, and theology are. Lawyers do not push the boundaries of understanding, they're clerks. That aside, laws are not divorced from reality, they're agreements that members of a society enter into regarding how the society is supposed to function. To study law is to study the way society works. Yes, society is an artificial construct, which why law is not a field of inquiry, but it still provably exists.
  - Aerbil313 3y ago
    Again this is your viewpoint. Very naive of you to think that religion, scripture, or existence of God are unprovable problems. Many people don’t agree with you on the both sides. Many think there is definitively no God and many think there is.

maksimur 3y ago

Generally speaking university gives you the tools and guides you. Most of the people aren't able to study university level subjects on their own.

bluescrn 3y ago
That was the idea in the past. University now teaches you precisely what to think, and makes clear the consequences of ‘wrongthink’.
deadbeeves 3y ago
That might be the case for other disciplines, but it certainly isn't for philosophy. There are no special techniques, you just read what other people have said on the subject. What else is there?
- jamilton 3y ago
  Discussions and having a peer group seems like it would be helpful for learning philosophy.
  - deadbeeves 3y ago
    Sure, but my question was about the purpose of studying philosophy in university. "It's easier than doing it by yourself" is not a purpose. There's still nothing you can do with what you've learned, other than become a professor.
    - travisjungroth 3y ago
      I just want to point out that you haven’t made a good argument for this to be true at all. One person does not make a pyramid scheme. Someone into cooking and teaching could go to culinary school and tell you their dream is to be a culinary instructor. Doesn’t make it a pyramid scheme. Philosophy has one of the highest average incomes of degrees, because of the number of graduates that go into law and business.
      - deadbeeves 3y ago
        The implicit argument is that I don't see what else one could possibly do with a degree in philosophy. > Philosophy has one of the highest average incomes of degrees, because of the number of graduates that go into law and business. And why do they need those degrees in order to do that? What are they employed to do?
        travisjungroth 3y ago
        One thing you can do with a degree in philosophy is get into law school. After graduating from law school you can be employed as a lawyer. They’re not philosophy lawyers, just normal lawyers. This isn’t some fringe thing. Play around with some Google searches like “what can you do with a philosophy degree?”, “best pre-law degrees”, “philosophy and law school” and you will see what else one could possibly do with a degree in philosophy.
        deadbeeves 3y ago
        I didn't think I needed to specify "that you can't do without a philosophy degree". You can get into law school without a philosophy degree, too.

Aerbil313 3y ago

> It's not like theology and philosophy study anything real. That is a viewpoint. This is the exact fallacy pointed out upper in the thread. This is just a viewpoint of yours, however commonly held it may be in the society of today.

deadbeeves 3y ago
No, I'm not talking about something as banal as whether a god exists. I'm saying theology doesn't study anything real. It doesn't have the tools to determine whether a god exists, because it doesn't study reality, it studies scripture. That's not a point of view, that's what theology is. Regardless of whether magic exists, I think we can both agree we can't find out by reading Harry Potter. The same for philosophy. I like to half joke that modern philosophy is what's left after taking out all the useful parts of ancient natural philosophy and putting them into either mathematics or science.
- edgyquant 3y ago
  If you think this way you must also think lawyers don’t study anything real because they study laws.
  - deadbeeves 3y ago
    It's not really an apt analogy. Law is not a field of inquiry like science, philosophy, mathematics, and theology are. Lawyers do not push the boundaries of understanding, they're clerks. That aside, laws are not divorced from reality, they're agreements that members of a society enter into regarding how the society is supposed to function. To study law is to study the way society works. Yes, society is an artificial construct, which why law is not a field of inquiry, but it still provably exists.
- Aerbil313 3y ago
  Again this is your viewpoint. Very naive of you to think that religion, scripture, or existence of God are unprovable problems. Many people don’t agree with you on the both sides. Many think there is definitively no God and many think there is.