3 ms·

He did hit the priority button and say "Controls to the left." Bonin hit his priority button to take back control but didn't say he was taking back control.

mrguyorama 3y ago
The reality is there is not a single thing you can legislate or train that will prevent a pilot from flying a perfectly working plane into the ground if they get stubborn. Aircraft emergencies are all about keeping you out of panic so that your natural instincts don't surface, because pretty much every natural or intrinsic human instinct, if followed, will just result in you flying the plane into the ground. Every sense you have is overwhelmed with "things aren't working the way I know they are supposed to and my control inputs seemingly have random results", and in a panic, your brain REALLY wants to revert to "just keep going up, away from danger", which is the opposite of what you need to do 95% of the time. The only fix in this case would have been literally evicting that pilot from the cockpit, and there's no button for that.
- jimmaswell 3y ago
  > The only fix in this case would have been literally evicting that pilot from the cockpit, and there's no button for that. Military jets have such a button. Maybe commercial needs to take some inspiration?
  - twelve40 3y ago
    what, an ejector to parachute the pilots, fuck the passengers? that would be pretty funny. It does save the airline pilot replacement training though. Or maybe an ejector to throw just the bad pilot out?
    - jimmaswell 3y ago
      Just the bad pilot is what I had in mind
_cenw 3y ago
Reading the CVR again, he did in fact ask for the controls ("So give me the controls") several times, but still seemed to be under the impression that they were in overspeed, or at least had to climb. I think my sibling comment is probably right, Bonin would've required much more severe shouting to take his hand off the stick. Certainly worth reading: https://bea.aero/uploads/tx_elyextendttnews/annexe.01.en.pdf https://bea.aero/uploads/tx_elyextendttnews/annexe.01.en.pdf

mrguyorama 3y ago

The reality is there is not a single thing you can legislate or train that will prevent a pilot from flying a perfectly working plane into the ground if they get stubborn. Aircraft emergencies are all about keeping you out of panic so that your natural instincts don't surface, because pretty much every natural or intrinsic human instinct, if followed, will just result in you flying the plane into the ground. Every sense you have is overwhelmed with "things aren't working the way I know they are supposed to and my control inputs seemingly have random results", and in a panic, your brain REALLY wants to revert to "just keep going up, away from danger", which is the opposite of what you need to do 95% of the time. The only fix in this case would have been literally evicting that pilot from the cockpit, and there's no button for that.

jimmaswell 3y ago
> The only fix in this case would have been literally evicting that pilot from the cockpit, and there's no button for that. Military jets have such a button. Maybe commercial needs to take some inspiration?
- twelve40 3y ago
  what, an ejector to parachute the pilots, fuck the passengers? that would be pretty funny. It does save the airline pilot replacement training though. Or maybe an ejector to throw just the bad pilot out?
  - jimmaswell 3y ago
    Just the bad pilot is what I had in mind

_cenw 3y ago

Reading the CVR again, he did in fact ask for the controls ("So give me the controls") several times, but still seemed to be under the impression that they were in overspeed, or at least had to climb. I think my sibling comment is probably right, Bonin would've required much more severe shouting to take his hand off the stick. Certainly worth reading: https://bea.aero/uploads/tx_elyextendttnews/annexe.01.en.pdf https://bea.aero/uploads/tx_elyextendttnews/annexe.01.en.pdf