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> Phasing out natural gas in new construction is going to cause this passion play in slow motion. Have you priced out induction stoves? Phew. More than two thi
by burkaman 3y ago
> Phasing out natural gas in new construction is going to cause this passion play in slow motion. Have you priced out induction stoves? Phew.
More than two thirds of US households already have electric stoves, and normal non-induction electric stoves are about the same price as gas ones. A ban on gas stoves would only affect rich people for the most part.
- DoingIsLearning 3y ago> A ban on gas stoves would only affect rich people for the most part. And professional kitchens. For the record I agree with phasing them out but I can see restaurant chefs fighting hard against it.
- mschuster91 3y agoMostly the old guard who doesn't want to adapt to induction ovens and Döner Kebab shops where there really is no replacement for a proper gas grill. At least here in Europe, many restaurants are switching because the writing is on the wall that natural gas will get very expensive very soon.
- cbluth 3y agoSo soon it that became expensive since the last year or so
- burkaman 3y agoSure, but all actual bans in the US so far have made exceptions for commercial kitchens.
- bluGill 3y agoIndication stoves are claimed to be as good as gas. However the cheapest induction stove in the US is 3x the price of the cheapest gas or electric. And if you go stove shopping you with find lots of options for gas or regular electric, but often only one induction model - if you want some combination of features and are willing to pay - you often still can't get it with induction. (dual ovens, number of burners, burner configuration, non-standard widths - there are lots of options that are at least interesting to someone who is cooking)
- mrDmrTmrJ 3y agoRespectfully - all of these "issues" get solved when you go from ~1%->100% market share. 100x increases in manufacturing volumes will do amazing things for final cost. Expanded market share to 100% will lead to every features imaginable being offered to the market. Ending gas stoves, and gas distribution in general, is a huge win. Just as phasing out incandescent light bulbs was a huge win. Each "infrastructure grid" that we run to every building (Electricity, Water/Sewer, Roads, IT, natural gas) is overwhelmingly expensive to build and maintain. And if you don't maintain it - you blow up San Bruno[1]. It would be great to delete one! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Bruno_pipeline_explosion https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Bruno_pipeline_explosion
- bluGill 3y agoThe problem is we are not at a high market share (in the US), and it will be a while before they gain. I hate my current stove, but no way am I paying the cost for a new one. I also have vacations and other things I want. (As a programmer my income is well above average, so I have to assume the costs are only more prohibitive for most people)
- maccard 3y agoAgreed. I was shocked at the cost of an induction stove top in the US when I looked recently. £350 buys you a great induction stove top in the UK (I paid less for a neff nN50 just before COVID). $1000 only just buys you an entry level one on the US.
- burkaman 3y agoI claim that ordinary electric coil stoves are as good as gas for nearly every non-commercial use case, and the moderate popularity of gas stoves was almost entirely manufactured by the gas industry. I understand that some things are harder, like using a wok, but there are easy workarounds, and most Americans never try to do these things anyway. Electric stoves are also strictly better at a lot of things - very high heat, very low heat, cleaning, repairing, not polluting the air, etc.
- 3y ago
- terribleperson 3y agoWhen it comes to cooking, non-induction electric stoves are a downgrade from gas stoves, even if they're the same price. Induction stoves are at least an upgrade in some respects, but a downgrade in terms of cookware compatibility. Phasing out gas stoves might be the future, but I wouldn't describe it as something that only affects rich people.
- burkaman 3y agoI disagree. For all common tasks (and most uncommon tasks) that Americans do with a stove, non-induction electric stoves are as good or better than gas.
- nelsondev 3y agoI’ve cooked on both and prefer gas. For pots with curvature (woks), induction doesn’t work well. Induction is nice for boiling water/soups, but frying is better with gas. Gas is also more user friendly as a broiler in the oven for toasting than a slow to heat electric element.
- eldaisfish 3y agogas is also incredibly wasteful. the efficiency of a resistive element stove is in the 80-90% range while for gas, it is in the 20s if you are lucky. most of the heat in a gas stove is lost to the environment. The “better” you report is just perception. there is zero evidence or measurements to back that up.
- fghorow 3y agoErrr, assuming that your electricity comes from a combustion source and a simple cycle power plant, at _best_ the work derived from the heat is about 35%. You need to account for that in your 80-90% calculation. (That is, .9 * .35 = .315 using the upper range of your guesstimate.) In other words, the waste heat has already been lost to the environment at the power generation source in that case. As always "it depends"... (In this case on the power generation mix in your local grid)
- edgyquant 3y agoSounds like it would effect 1/3 of US households
- YeBanKo 3y agoMoving from gas stove to induction electric stove is trivial. Upgrading from water and space heater to heat pump is neither simple nor cheap.