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I agree that there are many aspects of how elite universities work that are not what's best for society. I don't think this is the best thinkpiece on it though
by less_less 3y ago
I agree that there are many aspects of how elite universities work that are not what's best for society. I don't think this is the best thinkpiece on it though. One small thing that jumped out at me is the bit about "we don't have to sort kids at 18, because most colleges teach the same stuff". To support this point, the author compared Harvard Math 1a to SIUE Math 150.
This is a bad comparison, because these are introductory math classes for first-year students who aren't math majors, used to satisfy distribution requirements or give math background for non-math-intensive courses. There's a placement system to decide what math class to take, probably at both universities, but here is Harvard's (2020-2021):
https://www.math.harvard.edu/media/Math-for-first-year-students-2020-2021.pdf https://www.math.harvard.edu/media/Math-for-first-year-stude...
As you can see, first-year Harvard math or physics majors sometimes take Math 21, but more likely Math 23, 25, or 55. (Math 55 is weirdly fetishized, but that's another story.) These classes are significantly more rigorous than Math 1.
Having taken math courses for math majors at both an Ivy school and a decent non-Ivy, it is my experience that while they teach roughly the same subjects, they do not teach the same things within those subjects, nor at the same pace, nor to the same level of rigor. Nor are the students in those classes equally good at math. So, while sorting those students can and does contribute to injustice (especially with the actual way it's done!), it's also not a completely pointless just for the sake of giving gold stars.
- laidoffamazon 3y ago> Having taken math courses for math majors at both an Ivy school and a decent non-Ivy, it is my experience that while they teach roughly the same subjects, they do not teach the same things within those subjects, nor at the same pace, nor to the same level of rigor. Nor are the students in those classes equally good at math. So, while sorting those students can and does contribute to injustice (especially with the actual way it's done!), it's also not a completely pointless just for the sake of giving gold stars. OK, and? How does this change anything? You have to be a PhD to be a mathematician anyway. I've become negatively polarized against this rigor fetishization, which serves exclusively to otherize normal folks in increasingly esoteric ways
- less_less 3y ago> OK, and? How does this change anything? You have to be a PhD to be a mathematician anyway. I don't understand your objection. Comprehensive math training is useful in areas other than academic research math, and it's not like PhD programs erase or overwrite all math instruction from before you entered that program.
- laidoffamazon 3y agoI don't think it matters at all, actually. Covering 10% less material in a real analysis class at Wayne State vs. MIT has basically no bearing on society, or even the students at either.