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Agree BC is a laundable goal and appreciate their efforts. Though I do wish it didn't include limiting passwords to obscenely short lengths or absurd subsets of

Agree BC is a laundable goal and appreciate their efforts. Though I do wish it didn't include limiting passwords to obscenely short lengths or absurd subsets of characters.

keepamovin 3y ago
Yeah those 8+3 file names sure birthed some creative abbreviations. Necessity, mother, all that
- queuebert 3y ago
  Brevity forces thought, which I prefer to "Putting a Sentence in a File Name.docx". FORTRAN originally had the same limitation for function names, and that lead to some classics such as GEMM and SAXPY.
  - djbusby 3y ago
    Those two are obviously GetExtendedMemoryMap and Saxophone.
  - pluijzer 3y ago
    Very loosely related, but I really dislike the excepted design pattern for that cases where functions names are something like AssertThatOnePlusOneIsReturnAlwaysTwoAndNeverFive. It looks ridiculous, smells like a hack, and I cannot think of any reason why giving a description of the test couldn't be handled by the testing framework in a more graceful way.
    - prepend 3y ago
      Me too, I prefer function names like “assert_that_one_plus_one_is_return_always_two_and_never_five.” All kidding aside, but I gave up on this argument because I think people either get it or don’t and aside from trying a little conversation or something with guidance it’s a “can’t fix stupid” situation. People usually want to explain why it’s so important and that’s worse than suffering their long function name. I think it’s better to just accept ridiculous than to try to get consensus on what’s ridiculous and a spiral of wasted time. The upside is that it doesn’t matter any more since long function names are supported and work. And autocomplete means it’s just as easy to use as “ATOPOIRA” or whatever madness they would name it with some restrictions.
  - xp84 3y ago
    When it comes to file names, I disagree that brevity serves a useful purpose. I name my files like I’m an Amazon reseller so that I’m sure to find it with Search later no matter which detail I remember. “Budget Spreadsheet (worked on with Jane) with projections with and without buying a new Tesla Model Y or Chevy Chevrolet Bolt - 2023 2024 2025.xlsx” that’s my idea of a file name.
    - Dalewyn 3y ago
      If it floats your boat, you do you my dude. But that being said, you're the reason why file systems are abstracted away more and more with all file system queries force fed through some kind of search engine.
      - xp84 3y ago
        > you're the reason why file systems are abstracted away more and more Citation needed. I'm pretty sure the reason that happened is that Gen Z (and heck, definitely a good chunk of my millennial generation too) weren't ever taught what files and directories even are, so for them to be able to manage, product designers moved to a combo of "Your documents live inside the app you made them with" and "You search for your documents and they'll come up." Notably though, they never solved the other problems the filesystem solves, such as "but where are my files actually, I need to move them between devices or give them to another person."
    - queuebert 3y ago
      Modern OSes can search within files for text, which mostly obviates using the filename for keywords.
      - nomel 3y ago
        They can also search images for subjects, location, etc. Still, it would have been nice if a standard metadata format could be included with each file, in a way that survives file transfers.
      - xp84 3y ago
  - keepamovin 3y ago
    I agree with that too. If it works it’s like ideograms or iconography. Woah, your examples: https://www.ibm.com/docs/en/essl/6.2?topic=vss-saxpy-daxpy-caxpy-zaxpy-multiply-vector-by-scalar-add-vector-store-in-vector https://www.ibm.com/docs/en/essl/6.2?topic=vss-saxpy-daxpy-c...
- glonq 3y ago
  Whenever I create a filename that is long or has spaces, I still pause and worry "okay, what might break if I do this", even though such concerns probably died a couple decades ago. Actually scripts breaking if files or paths have a space in them seems to be a thorn in the side of dev/ops/it folks that never goes away, does it?
  - ChrisSD 3y ago
    On Unix perhaps. Windows forced IT folks to deal with the issue by having folders like "Program Files". Even the user's folder used to be in "Documents and Settings" (but they backed down from that eventually and now it's just "Users").
    - justsomehnguy 3y ago
      > but they backed down from that eventually Only because they were started to hit MAX_PATH there: C:\Users\Johnathan Aparecido da Silva\AppData\Local\ASUS\ASUS System Control Interface\AsusSoftwareManager C:\Documents and Settings\Johnathan Aparecido da Silva\AppData\Local\ASUS\ASUS System Control Interface\AsusSoftwareManager
      - nomel 3y ago
        The `subst` command provides an easy way around that. Link the last folder somewhere closer to the root, to make longe-than-255 paths accessible. Then, when you're done, remove the link and your files are protected from pesky things like virus/malware scanners. I used it to hide my old virus/malware collection, made from what my computer was infected with through the years.
    - WirelessGigabit 3y ago
      To this date one needs to be careful with executing applications and spaces in the path. For example: D:\test>dir ... 08/10/2023 09:29 AM <DIR> . 08/10/2023 09:30 AM <DIR> Foo Bar 08/10/2023 09:35 AM 79 Foo.bat ... D:\test>dir "Foo Bar" ... 08/10/2023 09:30 AM <DIR> . 08/10/2023 09:29 AM <DIR> .. 08/10/2023 09:35 AM 79 Foo.bat ... D:\test>type Foo.bat @echo off echo Executable: %0 echo Path to executable: %~dp0 echo Params: %* D:\test>type "Foo Bar\Foo.bat" @echo off echo Executable: %0 echo Path to executable: %~dp0 echo Params: %* D:\test>Foo.bat hello Executable: Foo.bat Path to executable: D:\test\ Params: hello D:\test>Foo Bar\Foo.bat hello Executable: Foo Path to executable: D:\test\ Params: Bar\Foo.bat hello D:\test>"Foo Bar\Foo.bat" hello Executable: "Foo Bar\Foo.bat" Path to executable: D:\test\Foo Bar\ Params: hello D:\test> Mess up the quotes and you're executing something one level up.

Agree BC is a laundable goal and appreciate their efforts. Though I do wish it didn't include limiting passwords to obscenely short lengths or absurd subsets of characters.

keepamovin 3y ago

Yeah those 8+3 file names sure birthed some creative abbreviations. Necessity, mother, all that

queuebert 3y ago
Brevity forces thought, which I prefer to "Putting a Sentence in a File Name.docx". FORTRAN originally had the same limitation for function names, and that lead to some classics such as GEMM and SAXPY.
- djbusby 3y ago
  Those two are obviously GetExtendedMemoryMap and Saxophone.
- pluijzer 3y ago
  Very loosely related, but I really dislike the excepted design pattern for that cases where functions names are something like AssertThatOnePlusOneIsReturnAlwaysTwoAndNeverFive. It looks ridiculous, smells like a hack, and I cannot think of any reason why giving a description of the test couldn't be handled by the testing framework in a more graceful way.
  - prepend 3y ago
    Me too, I prefer function names like “assert_that_one_plus_one_is_return_always_two_and_never_five.” All kidding aside, but I gave up on this argument because I think people either get it or don’t and aside from trying a little conversation or something with guidance it’s a “can’t fix stupid” situation. People usually want to explain why it’s so important and that’s worse than suffering their long function name. I think it’s better to just accept ridiculous than to try to get consensus on what’s ridiculous and a spiral of wasted time. The upside is that it doesn’t matter any more since long function names are supported and work. And autocomplete means it’s just as easy to use as “ATOPOIRA” or whatever madness they would name it with some restrictions.
- xp84 3y ago
  When it comes to file names, I disagree that brevity serves a useful purpose. I name my files like I’m an Amazon reseller so that I’m sure to find it with Search later no matter which detail I remember. “Budget Spreadsheet (worked on with Jane) with projections with and without buying a new Tesla Model Y or Chevy Chevrolet Bolt - 2023 2024 2025.xlsx” that’s my idea of a file name.
  - Dalewyn 3y ago
    If it floats your boat, you do you my dude. But that being said, you're the reason why file systems are abstracted away more and more with all file system queries force fed through some kind of search engine.
    - xp84 3y ago
      > you're the reason why file systems are abstracted away more and more Citation needed. I'm pretty sure the reason that happened is that Gen Z (and heck, definitely a good chunk of my millennial generation too) weren't ever taught what files and directories even are, so for them to be able to manage, product designers moved to a combo of "Your documents live inside the app you made them with" and "You search for your documents and they'll come up." Notably though, they never solved the other problems the filesystem solves, such as "but where are my files actually, I need to move them between devices or give them to another person."
  - queuebert 3y ago
    Modern OSes can search within files for text, which mostly obviates using the filename for keywords.
    - nomel 3y ago
      They can also search images for subjects, location, etc. Still, it would have been nice if a standard metadata format could be included with each file, in a way that survives file transfers.
    - xp84 3y ago
- keepamovin 3y ago
  I agree with that too. If it works it’s like ideograms or iconography. Woah, your examples: https://www.ibm.com/docs/en/essl/6.2?topic=vss-saxpy-daxpy-caxpy-zaxpy-multiply-vector-by-scalar-add-vector-store-in-vector https://www.ibm.com/docs/en/essl/6.2?topic=vss-saxpy-daxpy-c...
glonq 3y ago
Whenever I create a filename that is long or has spaces, I still pause and worry "okay, what might break if I do this", even though such concerns probably died a couple decades ago. Actually scripts breaking if files or paths have a space in them seems to be a thorn in the side of dev/ops/it folks that never goes away, does it?
- ChrisSD 3y ago
  On Unix perhaps. Windows forced IT folks to deal with the issue by having folders like "Program Files". Even the user's folder used to be in "Documents and Settings" (but they backed down from that eventually and now it's just "Users").
  - justsomehnguy 3y ago
    > but they backed down from that eventually Only because they were started to hit MAX_PATH there: C:\Users\Johnathan Aparecido da Silva\AppData\Local\ASUS\ASUS System Control Interface\AsusSoftwareManager C:\Documents and Settings\Johnathan Aparecido da Silva\AppData\Local\ASUS\ASUS System Control Interface\AsusSoftwareManager
    - nomel 3y ago
      The `subst` command provides an easy way around that. Link the last folder somewhere closer to the root, to make longe-than-255 paths accessible. Then, when you're done, remove the link and your files are protected from pesky things like virus/malware scanners. I used it to hide my old virus/malware collection, made from what my computer was infected with through the years.
  - WirelessGigabit 3y ago
    To this date one needs to be careful with executing applications and spaces in the path. For example: D:\test>dir ... 08/10/2023 09:29 AM <DIR> . 08/10/2023 09:30 AM <DIR> Foo Bar 08/10/2023 09:35 AM 79 Foo.bat ... D:\test>dir "Foo Bar" ... 08/10/2023 09:30 AM <DIR> . 08/10/2023 09:29 AM <DIR> .. 08/10/2023 09:35 AM 79 Foo.bat ... D:\test>type Foo.bat @echo off echo Executable: %0 echo Path to executable: %~dp0 echo Params: %* D:\test>type "Foo Bar\Foo.bat" @echo off echo Executable: %0 echo Path to executable: %~dp0 echo Params: %* D:\test>Foo.bat hello Executable: Foo.bat Path to executable: D:\test\ Params: hello D:\test>Foo Bar\Foo.bat hello Executable: Foo Path to executable: D:\test\ Params: Bar\Foo.bat hello D:\test>"Foo Bar\Foo.bat" hello Executable: "Foo Bar\Foo.bat" Path to executable: D:\test\Foo Bar\ Params: hello D:\test> Mess up the quotes and you're executing something one level up.