5 ms·

Does anyone know how and why Gruber became an authoritative voice for Apple community?

by jsnk 15y ago

notatoad 15y ago
I think it's probably because he just kept trying so hard. There are other apple blogs, but nobody is quite as fanatical as gruber is. Also, despite the crazy amount of apple stuff he finds to post about, he actually does have a filter for crap - he doesn't bother with most of the more wild rumours or non-news like obscure patents apple filed for 5 years ago. He's a blatant apple fanboy, but unlike most others he's not a stupid fanboy.
- cobychapple 15y ago
  Exactly. If I read a review of an Apple product there, I know I'm going to be reading a positive one, but it's the clear details he goes into, the fact that they're reasonably well-written, and the interesting and relevant observations he makes along the way that I enjoy reading (and that I believe is noticeably lacking in many other sources of writing online, especially relating to technology).
- cooldeal 15y ago
  The real reason that is there is a fanatical fanbase, especially among sites like HN, who not only make sure his posts get top billing but also flag posts by Windows enthusiasts and insiders like Paul Thurrott are flagged to death, so much so that that http://winsupersite.com http://winsupersite.com is hellbanned from HN. Haven't notice an actual big Microsoft announcement get far less votes than Gruber's snide and often factually wrong take on it? It's the community of fanboys and worshippers he has created.
  - baddox 15y ago
    It's probably not because this community tends to like one of those bloggers over the other, but rather because this community simply tends to be more interested in Apple products than Microsoft products. Since this site is designed to demonstrate the interests of its users, uninteresting articles will appear to be "blacklisted."
    - cooldeal 15y ago
      It doesn't just appear to be "blacklisted", it's really blacklisted. Copy pasting from my own comment from another post in this article since it's relevant here too: Sure, that might explain why Thurott's articles don't make the front page and Gruber's do, but does it explain why they're completely hellbanned from HN from even appearing on the new page where people can actually see them and vote on it if they find it interesting? http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3408883 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3408883
- karpathy 15y ago
  "He's a blatant apple fanboy, but unlike most others he's not a stupid fanboy." Very nice. I think tikhonj's comment from below applies better here instead.
- baddox 15y ago
  Are you using "fanboy" to mean something other than "a male who is a fan?" Usually, "fanboy" is used pejoratively to refer to someone that claims fandom without thinking critically, or refuses to recognize flaws. On occasion, Gruber has arguably been guilty of that, but this article sounds perfectly fair and reasonable.
  - notatoad 15y ago
    This article is reasonable because the new iPad actually is good. Gruber is the very definition of a fanboy.
deleted 15y ago
[deleted]
samstave 15y ago
I think it is called being an Opportunist Fanboi. Maybe there is a new word in here someplace - because there is certainly a career to be made out of it, although he could just be the modern Cringly/Dvorak. FanOpp? EDIT: I love being downvoted for an honest and direct reply to a question.
- icebraining 15y ago
  How is he an opportunist?
- specialist 15y ago
  Cringely's not a fanboy. He's the quirky camp follower that spins a good yarn. Or a Zelig. Seriously, who does he not know? I love reading his stuff. Crazy ideas. Crazy insights, like that BBC TV connections guy. Always fun. Early PC Mag, Dvorak had a great column. Geeky insight, pretty good BS detector. Now he's just a crank with a libertarian vibe. Haven't read him in years. I actually met him once, early web days. Great guy. Learned he was a serious amateur civil war historian. Liking Dvorak (the guy) as much as I do, I stuck with him for a long time, hoping he'd get back to having fun. Oh well.
  - samstave 15y ago
    All three are of the same ilk in my book. Having been a very early follower of cringley, and previous married to Dvorak's niece - I do feel I have some context here... Personally - I find them all to be the same; Opportunistic writers (Yes, they all have skill - I was not disputing this fact) who have found a niche in hte market where they can fill it. I think ANY successful technology writer must be a fan boi to certain extent -- If all they ever did was shit on everything, then why read them? I think that fan boi, as a term, is just a modern (hipster, even) way of saying that we have a product evangelist. I do think that both cringley and dvorak were very much in this role early on - maybe they were much better writers, though, in their prime.
alaskamiller 15y ago
Consistency and dedication. Then he decided to be a full time blogger and sold weekly sponsorship slots. Selling out and charging enough to make for a very nice salary.
- Mythbusters 15y ago
  For the longest time I thought he and Walt Mossberg were Apple spokesmen.
redcircle 15y ago
He does original thinking. This includes analysis and synthesis. Additionally, he practices good journalism. He is one of the few people that I read routinely --- I don't read him because he is about Apple, but because of his original thinking. He isn't a fan boy, as many people like to belittle him; he discusses good design, and points out when others practice it, such as the latest Windows mobile (metro? Or something).
- recoiledsnake 15y ago
  >He does original thinking. This includes analysis and synthesis. Additionally, he practices good journalism. Really? Lets look at a recent example of such exemplary commentary: http://daringfireball.net/linked/2012/03/12/xyboard http://daringfireball.net/linked/2012/03/12/xyboard That's just one example, his constant hate of and sneering at not just anything Android but anything Google is what is exemplary and shows that he is a fanboy that like to play his fanbase for fun and profit, and his readers just lap it up.
  - redcircle 15y ago
    Sure he has disdain for the bad design that is Android, but he objectively has described why that is so over the years. That he dislikes Android, which clearly has a different design approach to Apple and Microsoft, doesn't make him a fan boy of Apple. If he didn't acknowledge the good design coming out of Microsoft these days, then you could argue that he blindly favors Apple. Perhaps you also refer to the drama that has developed from the competition between Google and Apple, and his criticisms of this, and of "don't be evil," etc; design and company culture can't be separated, and so it makes sense for him to approach that topic too. Just consider hiring practices at Google --- do applicants get evaluated for algorithmic abilities alone, or is there something more? Culture is important.
benologist 15y ago
Writing what people want to hear is a business model - half the stuff on HN these days was written for HN. Writing skills and the ability to connect some dots is all you need.
jsz0 15y ago
Basically for the same reasons conservatives listen to Rush Limbaugh and liberals read Frank Rich. There's a place for objective journalism but it's not the only way. What Gruber does is more of a specialized type of journalism. If you've already made up your mind you don't necessarily want to waste time with the other points of view. For example if you really like basketball you would probably prefer to read a blog that focuses on basketball instead of a blog that's comparing basketball to other sports in an objective way. It would really be a waste of your time since you've already decided you like basketball. When it comes to relatively unimportant things like technology, sports, food, video games, your favorite brand of soda, etc there's a lot less value in objective journalism. I prefer specialized journalism in that context. I'm more interested in the opinions and thoughts of someone who shares my viewpoint because they are more likely to focus on the details that are important to me. We're also likely starting from a common point so not every tiny detail has to be explained verbosely. We all kind of 'get it' so there's no need to rehash it. His comparison of the iPhone 3GS->4 for example is something an Apple user going to understand immediately. He doesn't have to write 300 words describing the contrast using examples of a bunch of products I've never used because he has a reasonable expectation that I probably haven't used them. So why bother? I don't quite understand why people are so hung up on objective journalism in this context. This isn't reporting on the Watergate scandal or something. It's a consumer product. It's Coke vs. Pepsi. I don't think Gruber needs to aspire to be Edward R. Murrow here. He can proudly write for the home-team if he wants to. Another blog that is anti/pro/objective/etc is only a click away. He certainly doesn't tout himself as being the authoritative beacon of objective journalism.

Does anyone know how and why Gruber became an authoritative voice for Apple community?

by jsnk 15y ago

Does anyone know how and why Gruber became an authoritative voice for Apple community?

I think it's probably because he just kept trying so hard. There are other apple blogs, but nobody is quite as fanatical as gruber is. Also, despite the crazy amount of apple stuff he finds to post about, he actually does have a filter for crap - he doesn't bother with most of the more wild rumours or non-news like obscure patents apple filed for 5 years ago. He's a blatant apple fanboy, but unlike most others he's not a stupid fanboy.

cobychapple 15y ago
Exactly. If I read a review of an Apple product there, I know I'm going to be reading a positive one, but it's the clear details he goes into, the fact that they're reasonably well-written, and the interesting and relevant observations he makes along the way that I enjoy reading (and that I believe is noticeably lacking in many other sources of writing online, especially relating to technology).
cooldeal 15y ago
The real reason that is there is a fanatical fanbase, especially among sites like HN, who not only make sure his posts get top billing but also flag posts by Windows enthusiasts and insiders like Paul Thurrott are flagged to death, so much so that that http://winsupersite.com http://winsupersite.com is hellbanned from HN. Haven't notice an actual big Microsoft announcement get far less votes than Gruber's snide and often factually wrong take on it? It's the community of fanboys and worshippers he has created.
- baddox 15y ago
  It's probably not because this community tends to like one of those bloggers over the other, but rather because this community simply tends to be more interested in Apple products than Microsoft products. Since this site is designed to demonstrate the interests of its users, uninteresting articles will appear to be "blacklisted."
  - cooldeal 15y ago
    It doesn't just appear to be "blacklisted", it's really blacklisted. Copy pasting from my own comment from another post in this article since it's relevant here too: Sure, that might explain why Thurott's articles don't make the front page and Gruber's do, but does it explain why they're completely hellbanned from HN from even appearing on the new page where people can actually see them and vote on it if they find it interesting? http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3408883 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3408883
karpathy 15y ago
"He's a blatant apple fanboy, but unlike most others he's not a stupid fanboy." Very nice. I think tikhonj's comment from below applies better here instead.
baddox 15y ago
Are you using "fanboy" to mean something other than "a male who is a fan?" Usually, "fanboy" is used pejoratively to refer to someone that claims fandom without thinking critically, or refuses to recognize flaws. On occasion, Gruber has arguably been guilty of that, but this article sounds perfectly fair and reasonable.
- notatoad 15y ago
  This article is reasonable because the new iPad actually is good. Gruber is the very definition of a fanboy.

deleted 15y ago

[deleted]

samstave 15y ago

I think it is called being an Opportunist Fanboi. Maybe there is a new word in here someplace - because there is certainly a career to be made out of it, although he could just be the modern Cringly/Dvorak. FanOpp? EDIT: I love being downvoted for an honest and direct reply to a question.

icebraining 15y ago
How is he an opportunist?
specialist 15y ago
Cringely's not a fanboy. He's the quirky camp follower that spins a good yarn. Or a Zelig. Seriously, who does he not know? I love reading his stuff. Crazy ideas. Crazy insights, like that BBC TV connections guy. Always fun. Early PC Mag, Dvorak had a great column. Geeky insight, pretty good BS detector. Now he's just a crank with a libertarian vibe. Haven't read him in years. I actually met him once, early web days. Great guy. Learned he was a serious amateur civil war historian. Liking Dvorak (the guy) as much as I do, I stuck with him for a long time, hoping he'd get back to having fun. Oh well.
- samstave 15y ago
  All three are of the same ilk in my book. Having been a very early follower of cringley, and previous married to Dvorak's niece - I do feel I have some context here... Personally - I find them all to be the same; Opportunistic writers (Yes, they all have skill - I was not disputing this fact) who have found a niche in hte market where they can fill it. I think ANY successful technology writer must be a fan boi to certain extent -- If all they ever did was shit on everything, then why read them? I think that fan boi, as a term, is just a modern (hipster, even) way of saying that we have a product evangelist. I do think that both cringley and dvorak were very much in this role early on - maybe they were much better writers, though, in their prime.

alaskamiller 15y ago

Consistency and dedication. Then he decided to be a full time blogger and sold weekly sponsorship slots. Selling out and charging enough to make for a very nice salary.

Mythbusters 15y ago
For the longest time I thought he and Walt Mossberg were Apple spokesmen.

redcircle 15y ago

He does original thinking. This includes analysis and synthesis. Additionally, he practices good journalism. He is one of the few people that I read routinely --- I don't read him because he is about Apple, but because of his original thinking. He isn't a fan boy, as many people like to belittle him; he discusses good design, and points out when others practice it, such as the latest Windows mobile (metro? Or something).

recoiledsnake 15y ago
>He does original thinking. This includes analysis and synthesis. Additionally, he practices good journalism. Really? Lets look at a recent example of such exemplary commentary: http://daringfireball.net/linked/2012/03/12/xyboard http://daringfireball.net/linked/2012/03/12/xyboard That's just one example, his constant hate of and sneering at not just anything Android but anything Google is what is exemplary and shows that he is a fanboy that like to play his fanbase for fun and profit, and his readers just lap it up.
- redcircle 15y ago
  Sure he has disdain for the bad design that is Android, but he objectively has described why that is so over the years. That he dislikes Android, which clearly has a different design approach to Apple and Microsoft, doesn't make him a fan boy of Apple. If he didn't acknowledge the good design coming out of Microsoft these days, then you could argue that he blindly favors Apple. Perhaps you also refer to the drama that has developed from the competition between Google and Apple, and his criticisms of this, and of "don't be evil," etc; design and company culture can't be separated, and so it makes sense for him to approach that topic too. Just consider hiring practices at Google --- do applicants get evaluated for algorithmic abilities alone, or is there something more? Culture is important.

benologist 15y ago

Writing what people want to hear is a business model - half the stuff on HN these days was written for HN. Writing skills and the ability to connect some dots is all you need.

jsz0 15y ago

Basically for the same reasons conservatives listen to Rush Limbaugh and liberals read Frank Rich. There's a place for objective journalism but it's not the only way. What Gruber does is more of a specialized type of journalism. If you've already made up your mind you don't necessarily want to waste time with the other points of view. For example if you really like basketball you would probably prefer to read a blog that focuses on basketball instead of a blog that's comparing basketball to other sports in an objective way. It would really be a waste of your time since you've already decided you like basketball. When it comes to relatively unimportant things like technology, sports, food, video games, your favorite brand of soda, etc there's a lot less value in objective journalism. I prefer specialized journalism in that context. I'm more interested in the opinions and thoughts of someone who shares my viewpoint because they are more likely to focus on the details that are important to me. We're also likely starting from a common point so not every tiny detail has to be explained verbosely. We all kind of 'get it' so there's no need to rehash it. His comparison of the iPhone 3GS->4 for example is something an Apple user going to understand immediately. He doesn't have to write 300 words describing the contrast using examples of a bunch of products I've never used because he has a reasonable expectation that I probably haven't used them. So why bother? I don't quite understand why people are so hung up on objective journalism in this context. This isn't reporting on the Watergate scandal or something. It's a consumer product. It's Coke vs. Pepsi. I don't think Gruber needs to aspire to be Edward R. Murrow here. He can proudly write for the home-team if he wants to. Another blog that is anti/pro/objective/etc is only a click away. He certainly doesn't tout himself as being the authoritative beacon of objective journalism.