3 ms·

I think the boiled frog is a perfect analogy. I grew up always assuming there would be a long commute. I couldn't afford to move out of my parents house for alm

by pc86 3y ago

I think the boiled frog is a perfect analogy. I grew up always assuming there would be a long commute. I couldn't afford to move out of my parents house for almost a year out of school in my first job (2008 making less than $30k/yr) so I spent 7 or 8 months driving an hour each way. I'm too young to remember but my dad spent the first few years of my life and several before that commuting 2 hours one way. Spending at least 30 minutes each way driving was just assumed.

steveBK123 3y ago
Yes, also the typical career cycle in HCOL areas is you are 22 and live in a dumpy apartment with roommates but close to work. You maybe couple up with someone by 30 and get a nicer place a bit further, but still within a 20-40min transit commute. Finally you maybe decide to start a family by 40, and move out to somewhere 40-60min commute, if not further. Each step is just a small increment worse. But when you go from remote back to the worst level, it's jarring. Objectively, transit has also gotten worse in some cities (NYC, DC) since COVID and still not recovered. So we are also returning to something worse than where we left it!
- nequo 3y ago
  In what way is transit worse in NYC and DC? Are trains and buses running on a sparser schedule today in these two cities than they were before COVID?
  - pschw 3y ago
    In the case of the LIRR: https://gothamist.com/news/lirr-riders-still-miffed-over-jamaica-transfer-after-mta-tweaks-schedules-for-grand-central-madison https://gothamist.com/news/lirr-riders-still-miffed-over-jam... https://nypost.com/2023/03/06/hell-on-wheels-bklyn-shuttles-longer-trains-still-leave-lirr-riders-fuming/ https://nypost.com/2023/03/06/hell-on-wheels-bklyn-shuttles-...
  - steveBK123 3y ago
    Well DC I know they had some serious train defects that took trains/lines out of service for repairs for some time and caused capacity reductions. https://www.washingtonpost.com/transportation/2022/09/22/metro-7000-series-silver-line/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/transportation/2022/09/22/met... NYC they are running fewer trains so even if overall ridership is down, the trains are as crowded or more crowded than ever. Further in NYC due to homeless/migrant population growth falling through the cracks, the subway ends up being the shelter of last resort. Finally violent crime on the subway increased substantially over covid, and while down is still not at 2019 levels. So while waiting longer for a train, you are more likely to be dealing with a general sense of crime/disorder/etc.
  - ghaff 3y ago
    Like DC apparently, Boston has had some serious long-deferred maintenance. The commuter rail at least also has a reduced schedule and no longer has an express train from further out--so I'm a good 2 hours door to door if I use transit to go (rarely) into my city office. Driving is more flexible but it's just as slow at rush hour.
- lotsofpulp 3y ago
  > Yes, also the typical career cycle in HCOL areas is you are 22 and live in a dumpy apartment with roommates but close to work. You maybe couple up with someone by 30 and get a nicer place a bit further, but still within a 20-40min transit commute. Finally you maybe decide to start a family by 40, and move out to somewhere 40-60min commute, if not further. I found this to be a depressing quality of life trajectory my coworkers were on when I worked in NYC. It was fun in my 20s without kids, but after that, it seems miserable.
  - steveBK123 3y ago
    Yup. The few that stayed in the city were funded in one way or another..
    - ghaff 3y ago
      Of all the people in my grad school class who got jobs in NYC finance after graduation, I can think of maybe one couple who stayed in the city after getting married/having kids.
- bfeynman 3y ago
  the brevity with which you describe the life trajectory for millions if not tens of millions of people is ... sigh.
  - idlewords 3y ago
    Commutatio longa, vita brevis
    - vel0city 3y ago
      Ego similis cervisiam
cm2012 3y ago
Growing up in NYC, I had three hours of commuting per day from age 14 to 26. Then I switched to work from home (this was before covid). I would never go back.

by pc86 3y ago

steveBK123 3y ago

Yes, also the typical career cycle in HCOL areas is you are 22 and live in a dumpy apartment with roommates but close to work. You maybe couple up with someone by 30 and get a nicer place a bit further, but still within a 20-40min transit commute. Finally you maybe decide to start a family by 40, and move out to somewhere 40-60min commute, if not further. Each step is just a small increment worse. But when you go from remote back to the worst level, it's jarring. Objectively, transit has also gotten worse in some cities (NYC, DC) since COVID and still not recovered. So we are also returning to something worse than where we left it!

nequo 3y ago
In what way is transit worse in NYC and DC? Are trains and buses running on a sparser schedule today in these two cities than they were before COVID?
- pschw 3y ago
  In the case of the LIRR: https://gothamist.com/news/lirr-riders-still-miffed-over-jamaica-transfer-after-mta-tweaks-schedules-for-grand-central-madison https://gothamist.com/news/lirr-riders-still-miffed-over-jam... https://nypost.com/2023/03/06/hell-on-wheels-bklyn-shuttles-longer-trains-still-leave-lirr-riders-fuming/ https://nypost.com/2023/03/06/hell-on-wheels-bklyn-shuttles-...
- steveBK123 3y ago
  Well DC I know they had some serious train defects that took trains/lines out of service for repairs for some time and caused capacity reductions. https://www.washingtonpost.com/transportation/2022/09/22/metro-7000-series-silver-line/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/transportation/2022/09/22/met... NYC they are running fewer trains so even if overall ridership is down, the trains are as crowded or more crowded than ever. Further in NYC due to homeless/migrant population growth falling through the cracks, the subway ends up being the shelter of last resort. Finally violent crime on the subway increased substantially over covid, and while down is still not at 2019 levels. So while waiting longer for a train, you are more likely to be dealing with a general sense of crime/disorder/etc.
- ghaff 3y ago
  Like DC apparently, Boston has had some serious long-deferred maintenance. The commuter rail at least also has a reduced schedule and no longer has an express train from further out--so I'm a good 2 hours door to door if I use transit to go (rarely) into my city office. Driving is more flexible but it's just as slow at rush hour.
lotsofpulp 3y ago
> Yes, also the typical career cycle in HCOL areas is you are 22 and live in a dumpy apartment with roommates but close to work. You maybe couple up with someone by 30 and get a nicer place a bit further, but still within a 20-40min transit commute. Finally you maybe decide to start a family by 40, and move out to somewhere 40-60min commute, if not further. I found this to be a depressing quality of life trajectory my coworkers were on when I worked in NYC. It was fun in my 20s without kids, but after that, it seems miserable.
- steveBK123 3y ago
  Yup. The few that stayed in the city were funded in one way or another..
  - ghaff 3y ago
    Of all the people in my grad school class who got jobs in NYC finance after graduation, I can think of maybe one couple who stayed in the city after getting married/having kids.
bfeynman 3y ago
the brevity with which you describe the life trajectory for millions if not tens of millions of people is ... sigh.
- idlewords 3y ago
  Commutatio longa, vita brevis
  - vel0city 3y ago
    Ego similis cervisiam

cm2012 3y ago

Growing up in NYC, I had three hours of commuting per day from age 14 to 26. Then I switched to work from home (this was before covid). I would never go back.