5 ms·

That's gonna be fun when Amazon switches to RISC-V for their next (or next+n) iteration of Graviton. ARM presence in the server market will go away like poof.

by snvzz 3y ago

That's gonna be fun when Amazon switches to RISC-V for their next (or next+n) iteration of Graviton. ARM presence in the server market will go away like poof. More than half of it.

ukuina 3y ago
What indication exists that Amazon is considering RISC?
- geerlingguy 3y ago
  None, currently.
- klysm 3y ago
  It’s mere existence. If Amazon isn’t considering it I’d be surprised.
  - qwytw 3y ago
    Wouldn't designing your own cores be on a whole other level compared to what Amazon is doing now (licensing Neoverse)? If they don't feel confident they could build a competitive ARM core on their own (unlike Ampere which seems to be trying that) why would it be different with RISC-V which is still years behind ARM (on the high-end)?
    - snvzz 3y ago
      If not designing their own cores, RISC-V has far more options than ARM to license from. From a business continuity perspective, Amazon doesn't benefit from being locked to a single vendor for its CPU core IP.
      - qwytw 3y ago
        > RISC-V has far more options Like what? Are there any high-end RISC-V cores that proven to be competitive with Neoverse you could license? It all just seem hypothetical to me at this point and I really struggle trying to understand who and why would design cores to license them to others? Looking at ARM it just doesen't seem like a great business model compared to making them yourself..
        snvzz 3y ago
        >Are there any high-end RISC-V cores that proven to be competitive with Neoverse you could license? Look into Tenstorrent Ascalon, which is supposedly competitive with projected Zen5 performance. Ascalon has, by the way, already been licensed to LG[0]. RISC-V is inevitable. 0. https://www.eetasia.com/jim-keller-on-ai-risc-v-tenstorrents-move-to-edge-ip/ https://www.eetasia.com/jim-keller-on-ai-risc-v-tenstorrents...
        qwytw 3y ago
        Sounds good. Are there any benchmarks? Can you but it? How much does it cost? > RISC-V is inevitable. I'm sorry but you sound a bit like the "Crypto bros" from a few years ago.
    - klysm 3y ago
      I’m not sure why they’d have to be designing their own cores
      - qwytw 3y ago
        What other options would they have? Why would anyone share their own high-end cores when margins from producing and selling them yourself are much higher than form licensing (looking at ARM).
221qqwe 3y ago
Well it's certainly going to be fun for their competitors when Amazon ends up being 5-10 years behind AMD/Intel/Ampere when they do that.
x-complexity 3y ago
> That's gonna be fun when Amazon switches to RISC-V for their next (or next+n) iteration of Graviton. > ARM presence in the server market will go away like poof. More than half of it. This is a borderline fetishistic delusion to think that this could happen immediately in the first place. The changeover from x86/64 to ARM for AWS customers didn't even go this fast, and that's WITH the help & stability provided by the extensive tooling & ecosystem around ARM. RISC-V is nowhere near to being able to provide the same sort of tooling for years to come, and this comes from someone that loves the architecture's openness.

by snvzz 3y ago

That's gonna be fun when Amazon switches to RISC-V for their next (or next+n) iteration of Graviton. ARM presence in the server market will go away like poof. More than half of it.

ukuina 3y ago

What indication exists that Amazon is considering RISC?

geerlingguy 3y ago
None, currently.
klysm 3y ago
It’s mere existence. If Amazon isn’t considering it I’d be surprised.
- qwytw 3y ago
  Wouldn't designing your own cores be on a whole other level compared to what Amazon is doing now (licensing Neoverse)? If they don't feel confident they could build a competitive ARM core on their own (unlike Ampere which seems to be trying that) why would it be different with RISC-V which is still years behind ARM (on the high-end)?
  - snvzz 3y ago
    If not designing their own cores, RISC-V has far more options than ARM to license from. From a business continuity perspective, Amazon doesn't benefit from being locked to a single vendor for its CPU core IP.
    - qwytw 3y ago
      > RISC-V has far more options Like what? Are there any high-end RISC-V cores that proven to be competitive with Neoverse you could license? It all just seem hypothetical to me at this point and I really struggle trying to understand who and why would design cores to license them to others? Looking at ARM it just doesen't seem like a great business model compared to making them yourself..
      - snvzz 3y ago
        >Are there any high-end RISC-V cores that proven to be competitive with Neoverse you could license? Look into Tenstorrent Ascalon, which is supposedly competitive with projected Zen5 performance. Ascalon has, by the way, already been licensed to LG[0]. RISC-V is inevitable. 0. https://www.eetasia.com/jim-keller-on-ai-risc-v-tenstorrents-move-to-edge-ip/ https://www.eetasia.com/jim-keller-on-ai-risc-v-tenstorrents...
        qwytw 3y ago
        Sounds good. Are there any benchmarks? Can you but it? How much does it cost? > RISC-V is inevitable. I'm sorry but you sound a bit like the "Crypto bros" from a few years ago.
  - klysm 3y ago
    I’m not sure why they’d have to be designing their own cores
    - qwytw 3y ago
      What other options would they have? Why would anyone share their own high-end cores when margins from producing and selling them yourself are much higher than form licensing (looking at ARM).

221qqwe 3y ago

Well it's certainly going to be fun for their competitors when Amazon ends up being 5-10 years behind AMD/Intel/Ampere when they do that.

x-complexity 3y ago

> That's gonna be fun when Amazon switches to RISC-V for their next (or next+n) iteration of Graviton. > ARM presence in the server market will go away like poof. More than half of it. This is a borderline fetishistic delusion to think that this could happen immediately in the first place. The changeover from x86/64 to ARM for AWS customers didn't even go this fast, and that's WITH the help & stability provided by the extensive tooling & ecosystem around ARM. RISC-V is nowhere near to being able to provide the same sort of tooling for years to come, and this comes from someone that loves the architecture's openness.