6 ms·

> For 99.9999% of humanity's history, penicillin was "never needed" *pure penicillin https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tocosh https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tocosh

> For 99.9999% of humanity's history, penicillin was "never needed" *pure penicillin https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tocosh https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tocosh and they are not the only ones to do something like this. I wonder why the American natives got so much sicker from European diseases than the Europeans did from the local native disease. It's almost like cities are petri dishes.

habinero 3y ago
Because the old world had plagues (diseases that spread fast and kill) and the new world did not. Plagues and pandemics are zoonotic, and the new world just didn't have any domesticable animals except llamas.
- pazimzadeh 3y ago
  > the new world just didn't have any domesticable animals except llamas Turkeys, llamas, ducks, mink, ostrich, etc.. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_domesticated_animals https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_domesticated_animals Anyway it sounds like you're referring to Francis Galton's old take on the topic which doesn't really hold up in many ways https://galton.org/essays/1860-1869/galton-1865-domestication-animals.pdf https://galton.org/essays/1860-1869/galton-1865-domesticatio... You haven't convinced me that there were no domesticable animals in the new world, or that that was the major factor. It also doesn't explain why new world people already had a need penicillin formulations (earlier comment). But if you are right, it sounds like the trade-offs that come with domestication may not be worth it except as accidental biological warfare. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/15539148/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/15539148/ Also, the rats that carried the black plague were not domesticable. Don't you think open sewers in the streets contributed to disease a bit..
  - habinero 3y ago
    The proof that there were no domesticable animals in the new world is that...no animals besides the llama [0] were domesticated. People lived here for tens of thousands of years. If something could have been domesticated, it would have, because that's what humans do. And yes, the black plague is zoonotic, as I said. And yes, cities do contribute, because packing a lot of people together give plagues fuel. Plagues are almost always zoonotic, because any disease that kills all its hosts also dies. Plagues usually have a reservoir in animals, mutates to jump to humans and kills them by accident, really. [0] And guinea pigs, I guess, but you can't build an empire on overgrown squeaky toys.
akerl_ 3y ago
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JEYh5WACqEk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JEYh5WACqEk is a good watch here, if you're curious why Europeans didn't catch reciprocal plagues when traveling to the Americas. Spoiler: it's what the adjacent comment said, the Americas didn't have the factors for plagues.

habinero 3y ago

Because the old world had plagues (diseases that spread fast and kill) and the new world did not. Plagues and pandemics are zoonotic, and the new world just didn't have any domesticable animals except llamas.

pazimzadeh 3y ago
> the new world just didn't have any domesticable animals except llamas Turkeys, llamas, ducks, mink, ostrich, etc.. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_domesticated_animals https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_domesticated_animals Anyway it sounds like you're referring to Francis Galton's old take on the topic which doesn't really hold up in many ways https://galton.org/essays/1860-1869/galton-1865-domestication-animals.pdf https://galton.org/essays/1860-1869/galton-1865-domesticatio... You haven't convinced me that there were no domesticable animals in the new world, or that that was the major factor. It also doesn't explain why new world people already had a need penicillin formulations (earlier comment). But if you are right, it sounds like the trade-offs that come with domestication may not be worth it except as accidental biological warfare. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/15539148/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/15539148/ Also, the rats that carried the black plague were not domesticable. Don't you think open sewers in the streets contributed to disease a bit..
- habinero 3y ago
  The proof that there were no domesticable animals in the new world is that...no animals besides the llama [0] were domesticated. People lived here for tens of thousands of years. If something could have been domesticated, it would have, because that's what humans do. And yes, the black plague is zoonotic, as I said. And yes, cities do contribute, because packing a lot of people together give plagues fuel. Plagues are almost always zoonotic, because any disease that kills all its hosts also dies. Plagues usually have a reservoir in animals, mutates to jump to humans and kills them by accident, really. [0] And guinea pigs, I guess, but you can't build an empire on overgrown squeaky toys.

akerl_ 3y ago

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JEYh5WACqEk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JEYh5WACqEk is a good watch here, if you're curious why Europeans didn't catch reciprocal plagues when traveling to the Americas. Spoiler: it's what the adjacent comment said, the Americas didn't have the factors for plagues.