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These are Tesla Loop tunnels. I honestly cannot believe that a city would give permission to build such a pyrrhic public transportation system, even if it is p
by manuelabeledo 3y ago
These are Tesla Loop tunnels.
I honestly cannot believe that a city would give permission to build such a pyrrhic public transportation system, even if it is privately owned. From the article:
"The convention center loop has been operational for about two years and has seen 1.2 million passengers over that span. The highest daily capacity of the system during that time is 32,000 riders."
The similarly planned Austin MetroRail has a yearly passenger volume of ~500,000, but at least it is more useful than this.
- kramerger 3y agoI don't believe the 1.2M number for a second. Go try it yourself, or watch the videos people have uploaded.
- 39 3y agoWhy would one or two arbitrary trips be indicative of an aggregate?
- kramerger 3y agoYou can quickly see the inefficiency of the whole idea compared to public transportation
- sidewndr46 3y agoIt's cars. Underground. How could you design a less efficient system? Unicycles driven by domesticated bears towing a fisher price cart?
- xnx 3y agoWaiting for a large train that only carries a few people not quite to their destinations is pretty inefficient.
- supertrope 3y agoA train or bus that only carries a few people is not really a problem. Because labor costs are the majority of public transit operating costs not vehicles it makes sense to use the largest vehicle everywhere. Using minibuses or smaller train cars just means you get capacity issues during rush hour and you can't standardize on one vehicle. You are right that public transit does not go door to door. Riders are expected to walk a block to the nearest station. If a transit system tries to replicate taxi service it would be too expensive or would really inflate waiting times for a ride.
- xnx 3y agoAbsolutely. Small capacity vehicles make no sense if they contain a human driver.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- brookst 3y ago1.2m over two years is 1640 people/day average. It looks like there are four operational stations, so 410 people/station/day? Is that really hard to believe? It’s shockingly low for public transit but seems an easy bar to clear.
- kalleboo 3y agoThe video linked in another comment here said that she had been trying to film it for a year, but they only run the loop when there is an event going on at the convention center. Seems like that ought to depress the numbers massively.
- jakelazaroff 3y agoJust to give a sense of how bad 1.2 million people over two years is: the NYC subway system carries significantly more people than that per day.
- rayiner 3y agoThose numbers aren’t possible literally anywhere else. Silver line phase II extension carried about 1.1 million people over six months. That’s the marquee project of the DC metro system—the only thing it has focused on building over the last decade (to the detriment of the rest of the system). Boring Company’s little demo carried a meaningful fraction as many passengers as that $3 billion dollar, decade-in-the-making transit project.
- jakelazaroff 3y agoIs it a meaningful fraction? What is the theoretical daily capacity of the Boring Company tunnels vs. the DC silver line extension? Even at this meager capacity, we’ve already heard reports of traffic in the tunnels.
- rayiner 3y agoThe theoretical capacity doesn’t matter because Silver Line ridership doesn’t come anywhere near capacity.
- lesuorac 3y agoIt's a bit amusing the city doesn't even think it will happen but is just approving it because all of the destinations told them to. > Las Vegas Mayor Carolyn Goodman isn’t sure the project will ever come to fruition, but voted in favor of the extension anyway, due to the urging of the various resorts and other entities in downtown. > “I am one who just does not believe will come to be, certainly not in my lifetime,”
- bryanlarsen 3y agoThe MetroRail will cost at least $10B. For ~100X the cost, I certainly hope it's more useful.
- manuelabeledo 3y agoThe current line did not cost $10B.
- bryanlarsen 3y agohttps://www.kxan.com/news/local/austin/project-connect-light-rails-will-likely-cost-10-3b-twice-as-much-as-planned/ https://www.kxan.com/news/local/austin/project-connect-light...
- manuelabeledo 3y agoThat's the planned Project Connect, not the current line.
- Veedrac 3y agoThat people think a city should ban a company from building underground transit without even letting them try when the alternatives are robustly known to be almost literally (if not just literally) too expensive, too slow, and too encumbered to build, is exactly why transit is too expensive, too slow, and too encumbered to build. It shocks me to no end how much people want to shoot themselves in the foot.
- jakelazaroff 3y agoWhat alternatives are you talking about? We know a subway would be significantly better than what they’re building now.
- rayiner 3y agoHow much would a 68 mile subway under Vegas cost?
- jakelazaroff 3y agoProbably marginally more than a 68 mile tunnel system for cars?
- Veedrac 3y ago> The US has a range of subway construction costs of $600 million to $2.6 billion per mile. The US median price cluster is $800 million to $1 billion per mile. 68 miles would cost the city around $50B, if past trends hold true. Contra, Vegas Loop is being fully covered by private funds. In defense, one subway mile is likely worth more than one Loop mile.
- rayiner 3y agoA modern 68-mile subway system under Vegas would cost probably $100 billion. LA just expanded its subway system for $1 billion a mile. In comparison, the Boring Company did the 1.7-mile Las Vegas Convention center tunnel for a $47 million fixed price.
- 3y ago
- Macha 3y agoEven privately owned, there's the problem that whatever tunnels they do build are going to be in the low hanging fruit and in the way of building actual subway systems in the future if a sensible transport policy starts.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]