4 ms·

I don't think the issue is so much "what should they do now", because what they should do now is constrained by what they can do. The issue is "what should the

by telent 15y ago

I don't think the issue is so much "what should they do now", because what they should do now is constrained by what they can do. The issue is "what should they have done in 2008?" - should they for example have said "please note that our current business model is not sustainable, and while you are welcome to enjoy it while it's here you are cautioned not to behave as though it will be here for ever"? Providing a limited, ephemeral, or best-effort service is a perfectly OK thing to do provided your service users know that's what you're doing and can (as raganwald says he has) tailor their behavour accordingly

ValG 15y ago
Great point, but it's unbelievably difficult do carry something like that out practically. Who are the CEO's customers, the market the company is targeting, or the company's employees? I'd argue both, the CEO is the visionary and cheerleader for the staff, and also the public image for the customers. If you come out and say we are not sustainable, guess how many employees you'll have at the end of the week? Guess how many customers? After putting 100's or 1000's of hours into something, you'd be hard pressed to find anyone willing to go that route
- Drbble 15y ago
  This is where honesty has to be given its due. I expect A CEO to honestly state the max plausible downside and upside of their business, and to have a decent argument (which I take with a grain of salt) for why they expect the upside to happen. Then I make my own estimate, somewhere between the extremes, and act accordingly. The CEOs I respect (as employers, vendors, and investments) behave this way.
  - ValG 15y ago
    not including warren buffet (ironic that he's considered one of the most ethical guys in the business and he's on top of the world), name a few CEOs. Not a call out, I just want to know who they are so I can start following them
    - deleted 15y ago
      [deleted]
    - Drbble 15y ago
      Warren Buffet is a an example. I don't want to name personal connections because I don't flaunt my real world identity on HN. Read Techcrunch (and hold your nose!) and look forward guest posts and interviews with folks who (once you strip away the upbeat marketing pep rally) seem to call out real issues in their industry and have built ethics into their business model -- pay based on voluntary customer buy in, transparency in customer communications, admitting mistakes (layoffs, bad features) and taking meaningful reactions, not just PR statements. Travelersjoy is one example I saw recently. They run an overpriced wedding registry, but they are totally transparent (check the FAQ) on how much they charge on the front and back end, so you can decide if the value is worthwhile. Contrast to your average credit card, who offer lavish bonuses to cardholders, paid for by a extorting fees from merchants.
    - Drbble 15y ago
      Joel Spolsky and Stackoverflow is a good example. They build a quality product, treat users with respect, and (I guess) are on a good track financially, and make their money in an aboveboard way. They even go so far as to build in some defenses (like Creative Commons licensing) to proactively preempt future possible evildoing. Stephen Wolfram (though an egomaniac that has picked some unfair fights against his employees) and his company Wolfram Research built a rather solid offering in "old style" proprietary commercial software with Mathematica and now Wolfram Alpha, making his money on incredibly high quality and pouring decades of revenue back into product development and offering a generous free tier of access and deep discounts for educational and personal use.
      - ValG 15y ago
        Thank you

by telent 15y ago

ValG 15y ago

Great point, but it's unbelievably difficult do carry something like that out practically. Who are the CEO's customers, the market the company is targeting, or the company's employees? I'd argue both, the CEO is the visionary and cheerleader for the staff, and also the public image for the customers. If you come out and say we are not sustainable, guess how many employees you'll have at the end of the week? Guess how many customers? After putting 100's or 1000's of hours into something, you'd be hard pressed to find anyone willing to go that route

Drbble 15y ago
This is where honesty has to be given its due. I expect A CEO to honestly state the max plausible downside and upside of their business, and to have a decent argument (which I take with a grain of salt) for why they expect the upside to happen. Then I make my own estimate, somewhere between the extremes, and act accordingly. The CEOs I respect (as employers, vendors, and investments) behave this way.
- ValG 15y ago
  not including warren buffet (ironic that he's considered one of the most ethical guys in the business and he's on top of the world), name a few CEOs. Not a call out, I just want to know who they are so I can start following them
  - deleted 15y ago
    [deleted]
  - Drbble 15y ago
    Warren Buffet is a an example. I don't want to name personal connections because I don't flaunt my real world identity on HN. Read Techcrunch (and hold your nose!) and look forward guest posts and interviews with folks who (once you strip away the upbeat marketing pep rally) seem to call out real issues in their industry and have built ethics into their business model -- pay based on voluntary customer buy in, transparency in customer communications, admitting mistakes (layoffs, bad features) and taking meaningful reactions, not just PR statements. Travelersjoy is one example I saw recently. They run an overpriced wedding registry, but they are totally transparent (check the FAQ) on how much they charge on the front and back end, so you can decide if the value is worthwhile. Contrast to your average credit card, who offer lavish bonuses to cardholders, paid for by a extorting fees from merchants.
  - Drbble 15y ago
    Joel Spolsky and Stackoverflow is a good example. They build a quality product, treat users with respect, and (I guess) are on a good track financially, and make their money in an aboveboard way. They even go so far as to build in some defenses (like Creative Commons licensing) to proactively preempt future possible evildoing. Stephen Wolfram (though an egomaniac that has picked some unfair fights against his employees) and his company Wolfram Research built a rather solid offering in "old style" proprietary commercial software with Mathematica and now Wolfram Alpha, making his money on incredibly high quality and pouring decades of revenue back into product development and offering a generous free tier of access and deep discounts for educational and personal use.
    - ValG 15y ago
      Thank you