3 ms·

Worth adding that information to open street maps so that it available for other maps too.

Fnoord 3y ago
For sure, but for many people there's only Google Maps, and maybe Apple Maps. On the short term, catering to Google Maps makes sense. They'd add to another project if it were to be popular enough, and the network effect keeps Google Maps popular. Hence they get away with enshittification.
- atlintots 3y ago
  That's just another reason why it's worth adding that information to open street maps, if you are able to.
- throwaway9621 3y ago
  >They'd add to another project if it were to be popular enough, and the network effect keeps Google Maps popular. Hence they get away with enshittification. Ah yes, the chicken and egg logic of network effect excuses all. How about if people, idk, just evangelized more about the things they love to be smug about on HN? People should be shamed off enshittified platforms. Be "that guy" - or be a hypocrite. For Google it might a little more complicated, but for each one of us it's exactly this simple.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
yankput 3y ago
Compare the experience of adding stuff to OSM and to Google Maps. Much easier. OSM is for nerds. Very hard to add even basic info. Google Maps it’s trivial. Same as uploading photo to Google Maps is easier than adding it to WikiMedia Commons. Such is life. (Ironically one of the biggest sources of photos is commons is Panoramio; before Google merged it with Google Maps, the photos there defaulted to Creative Commons.)
- aembleton 3y ago
  How do I update stuff in Google Maps? For OSM, its a case of opening Street Complete and tapping on things. To add new features I have to use SCEE, which is more nerdy mainly because it involves using FDroid to install it. But I've no idea how to add, say a park bench to Google Maps.
  - verteu 3y ago
    Just tried it now and I found the experience incredibly easy: On desktop, right click on the map and choose "Add a missing place." On mobile, long-press to drop a pin, then scroll down to "Add a missing place." Does OSM require installing a parallel app store to add a park bench? Sounds like a UX-killer :/
    - aembleton 3y ago
      Just tried it on mobile and that is nice and easy, especially if you want to add a business. Not sure how you add a bench that way as I couldn't see the option, but I might be looking in the wrong place. You're right though, installing another app store is a non starter.
      - verteu 3y ago
        Good point -- I'm not sure if Google Maps tracks benches. (I'd guess it doesn't, but not positive.)
datavirtue 3y ago
OSM should be scraping Google maps.
- xp84 3y ago
  Legally how?
- WorldMaker 3y ago
  OSM has a two-way data sharing agreements directly with (among others) Apple and Bing/Microsoft. Additionally, the "Overture Foundation" with members including AWS/Amazon, Microsoft, Meta, and TomTom have a complicated indirect two-way data sharing agreement with OSM. (Overture Maps are a "curated" subset of OSM data and members are encouraged but not required to make contributions and updates to the maps directly upstream to OSM.) Google probably sees their data as a moat and likely aren't interested in two-way data sharing. (Given how many of their competitors are now involved directly or indirectly with OSM or Overture, they may be correct.) OSM probably can't legally scrape it without an agreement in place.

For sure, but for many people there's only Google Maps, and maybe Apple Maps. On the short term, catering to Google Maps makes sense. They'd add to another project if it were to be popular enough, and the network effect keeps Google Maps popular. Hence they get away with enshittification.

atlintots 3y ago
That's just another reason why it's worth adding that information to open street maps, if you are able to.
throwaway9621 3y ago
>They'd add to another project if it were to be popular enough, and the network effect keeps Google Maps popular. Hence they get away with enshittification. Ah yes, the chicken and egg logic of network effect excuses all. How about if people, idk, just evangelized more about the things they love to be smug about on HN? People should be shamed off enshittified platforms. Be "that guy" - or be a hypocrite. For Google it might a little more complicated, but for each one of us it's exactly this simple.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]

yankput 3y ago

Compare the experience of adding stuff to OSM and to Google Maps. Much easier. OSM is for nerds. Very hard to add even basic info. Google Maps it’s trivial. Same as uploading photo to Google Maps is easier than adding it to WikiMedia Commons. Such is life. (Ironically one of the biggest sources of photos is commons is Panoramio; before Google merged it with Google Maps, the photos there defaulted to Creative Commons.)

aembleton 3y ago
How do I update stuff in Google Maps? For OSM, its a case of opening Street Complete and tapping on things. To add new features I have to use SCEE, which is more nerdy mainly because it involves using FDroid to install it. But I've no idea how to add, say a park bench to Google Maps.
- verteu 3y ago
  Just tried it now and I found the experience incredibly easy: On desktop, right click on the map and choose "Add a missing place." On mobile, long-press to drop a pin, then scroll down to "Add a missing place." Does OSM require installing a parallel app store to add a park bench? Sounds like a UX-killer :/
  - aembleton 3y ago
    Just tried it on mobile and that is nice and easy, especially if you want to add a business. Not sure how you add a bench that way as I couldn't see the option, but I might be looking in the wrong place. You're right though, installing another app store is a non starter.
    - verteu 3y ago
      Good point -- I'm not sure if Google Maps tracks benches. (I'd guess it doesn't, but not positive.)

datavirtue 3y ago

OSM should be scraping Google maps.

xp84 3y ago
Legally how?
WorldMaker 3y ago
OSM has a two-way data sharing agreements directly with (among others) Apple and Bing/Microsoft. Additionally, the "Overture Foundation" with members including AWS/Amazon, Microsoft, Meta, and TomTom have a complicated indirect two-way data sharing agreement with OSM. (Overture Maps are a "curated" subset of OSM data and members are encouraged but not required to make contributions and updates to the maps directly upstream to OSM.) Google probably sees their data as a moat and likely aren't interested in two-way data sharing. (Given how many of their competitors are now involved directly or indirectly with OSM or Overture, they may be correct.) OSM probably can't legally scrape it without an agreement in place.