4 ms·

They have different coins. Why couldn't they have different notes? England and Scotland have different notes. I'm sure Germany and France could manage...

tialaramex 3y ago
I can answer this one. Weird money is bad. The coins don't really matter (England for a long time had pre-decimal coins still in circulation, everybody knew what they "meant" so it didn't matter that they were labelled wrong) but large denominations such as bank notes are likely to attract notice and should not be "weird". Almost everywhere, almost always (if you're about to write an objection about "Legal tender", go read what that phrase actually means and reconsider) what matters is whether the person accepting the money agrees this is money. So you want as much as possible for everybody to agree that this 50 Euro note is money, while this toy money from a Monopoly set is not money. Weird money interferes with that. You mention that there are visually distinct Scottish notes. There are. And their face value is exactly identical to English notes, also true. And yet, it is entirely possible that Scottish notes will not be accepted in my city here on England's South coast. Not because of some specific anti-Scottish bigotry but because Scotland is far away and people here have not seen your weird money. Story time. A few years ago I was at my favourite local Chinese restaurant, buying Duck Ho Fun (somewhere the other side of the city does even bigger noodles but it's too far to walk and I'm lazy) and a guy with a strong Scottish accent comes in. He wants something boring, I don't remember what, and he tries to pay with a Scottish note. The restaurant owner does not recognise this as money. Scotsman argues he "has" to take it [this is wrong] but the restaurant owner won't, it is clear that while they're arguing nobody will be actually working on my order, so, I take the Scotsman's weird money and swap it for my English money, which the restaurant owner accepts as good. Weird money is bad.
- Someone 3y ago
  > And yet, it is entirely possible that Scottish notes will not be accepted in my city here on England's South coast. Not because of some specific anti-Scottish bigotry… There’s another reason. Scottish pounds aren’t issued by the central bank, but by commercial banks and aren’t legal tender on England’s south coast (technically not anywhere in the UK, including Scotland) (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banknotes_of_Scotland https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banknotes_of_Scotland)
  - tialaramex 3y ago
    That's not a coherent reason? The guy operating a corner store isn't taking your money to Threadneedle Street, so why would he care where the notes are issued? His bank knows these notes are the same as the English ones, for them it makes no difference. Legal tender is irrelevant, you note that Scottish notes aren't legal tender in Scotland, but that's because no notes are legal tender in Scotland, it doesn't matter at all. History lesson. The Bank of England was a commercial bank, centuries ago the English government needed money for a navy to fight the French, and their scheme to raise money to pay for it was to agree that a Bank, the Bank of England, shall be created, a Limited Liability Corporation, owned by shareholders, able exclusively to issue notes against government borrowing. For the next few hundred years these shareholders and their successors did very well off this arrangement, and the Royal Navy was powerful enough even into the 20th century that it made Unternehmen Seelöwe [Sealion, a proposed invasion of England by Axis forces after the fall of France] completely impractical even though Hitler really wanted to. However, in the intervening centuries England became just one constituent part of Britain, and in 1946 the by now very much British government decided to Nationalise the bank, so today it's no longer a private commercial business.
- Dalewyn 3y ago
  We also have a similar phenomenon here in the US with our $2 dollar bills. They're legal tender and most people know about them, but they're very rare to see in circulation and use so there's the occasional shopkeeper or business that refuses them out of either ignorance or abundance of caution.
- memefrog 3y ago
  And yet they still exist, and the system still works fine. The coins are already "weird money". This isnt a problem as they have a common face. Notes could have a common face too.
Someone 3y ago
I think the thinking was that falsifying banknotes would be too easy if there were many different ones. Yes, people could turn over bank notes to check the common side, but that’s annoying. For coins, that’s less of a problem because they’re worth less and because it’s harder to make lots of money with fake coins (you’d have to make lots of them and, more importantly, find a way to spend them rapidly. Paying an expensive car/watch/smartphone/etc with coins is highly suspicious)
- memefrog 3y ago
  50% of the time you would not need to turn them over.
eptcyka 3y ago
My Scottish banknotes were often denied in London. Weird cash is bad - good cash is unambiguous about its denomination and validity.

tialaramex 3y ago

I can answer this one. Weird money is bad. The coins don't really matter (England for a long time had pre-decimal coins still in circulation, everybody knew what they "meant" so it didn't matter that they were labelled wrong) but large denominations such as bank notes are likely to attract notice and should not be "weird". Almost everywhere, almost always (if you're about to write an objection about "Legal tender", go read what that phrase actually means and reconsider) what matters is whether the person accepting the money agrees this is money. So you want as much as possible for everybody to agree that this 50 Euro note is money, while this toy money from a Monopoly set is not money. Weird money interferes with that. You mention that there are visually distinct Scottish notes. There are. And their face value is exactly identical to English notes, also true. And yet, it is entirely possible that Scottish notes will not be accepted in my city here on England's South coast. Not because of some specific anti-Scottish bigotry but because Scotland is far away and people here have not seen your weird money. Story time. A few years ago I was at my favourite local Chinese restaurant, buying Duck Ho Fun (somewhere the other side of the city does even bigger noodles but it's too far to walk and I'm lazy) and a guy with a strong Scottish accent comes in. He wants something boring, I don't remember what, and he tries to pay with a Scottish note. The restaurant owner does not recognise this as money. Scotsman argues he "has" to take it [this is wrong] but the restaurant owner won't, it is clear that while they're arguing nobody will be actually working on my order, so, I take the Scotsman's weird money and swap it for my English money, which the restaurant owner accepts as good. Weird money is bad.

Someone 3y ago
> And yet, it is entirely possible that Scottish notes will not be accepted in my city here on England's South coast. Not because of some specific anti-Scottish bigotry… There’s another reason. Scottish pounds aren’t issued by the central bank, but by commercial banks and aren’t legal tender on England’s south coast (technically not anywhere in the UK, including Scotland) (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banknotes_of_Scotland https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banknotes_of_Scotland)
- tialaramex 3y ago
  That's not a coherent reason? The guy operating a corner store isn't taking your money to Threadneedle Street, so why would he care where the notes are issued? His bank knows these notes are the same as the English ones, for them it makes no difference. Legal tender is irrelevant, you note that Scottish notes aren't legal tender in Scotland, but that's because no notes are legal tender in Scotland, it doesn't matter at all. History lesson. The Bank of England was a commercial bank, centuries ago the English government needed money for a navy to fight the French, and their scheme to raise money to pay for it was to agree that a Bank, the Bank of England, shall be created, a Limited Liability Corporation, owned by shareholders, able exclusively to issue notes against government borrowing. For the next few hundred years these shareholders and their successors did very well off this arrangement, and the Royal Navy was powerful enough even into the 20th century that it made Unternehmen Seelöwe [Sealion, a proposed invasion of England by Axis forces after the fall of France] completely impractical even though Hitler really wanted to. However, in the intervening centuries England became just one constituent part of Britain, and in 1946 the by now very much British government decided to Nationalise the bank, so today it's no longer a private commercial business.
Dalewyn 3y ago
We also have a similar phenomenon here in the US with our $2 dollar bills. They're legal tender and most people know about them, but they're very rare to see in circulation and use so there's the occasional shopkeeper or business that refuses them out of either ignorance or abundance of caution.
memefrog 3y ago
And yet they still exist, and the system still works fine. The coins are already "weird money". This isnt a problem as they have a common face. Notes could have a common face too.

Someone 3y ago

I think the thinking was that falsifying banknotes would be too easy if there were many different ones. Yes, people could turn over bank notes to check the common side, but that’s annoying. For coins, that’s less of a problem because they’re worth less and because it’s harder to make lots of money with fake coins (you’d have to make lots of them and, more importantly, find a way to spend them rapidly. Paying an expensive car/watch/smartphone/etc with coins is highly suspicious)

memefrog 3y ago
50% of the time you would not need to turn them over.

eptcyka 3y ago

My Scottish banknotes were often denied in London. Weird cash is bad - good cash is unambiguous about its denomination and validity.