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Yup, exactly. So through technology we’ve managed to created situations we cannot manage so the answer is more technology we likely will have zero control over

Yup, exactly. So through technology we’ve managed to created situations we cannot manage so the answer is more technology we likely will have zero control over or understand. Can you see see how ridiculous this can sound to some people ? We’ve created a ridiculous situation so I guess you’re right, the only way through it is more ridiculousness. In my opinion that story you’re telling me actually does create a perceived need for AGI. Edit: It sounds like in your world, this is some type of AI without agency or self preservation goals ? Just like an oracle with an interface or something ? I hate to say this but governments have all the information they need to make better decisions, they make them mostly based on lobbying. Not going to fun when AI can extract more oil at 1000x the speed, crush dissidents or capture your attention to sell you more shit even more effectively.

mdp2021 3y ago
And you would think that remaining without tools could be better? Like in Rousseau's ideal? Such as "It is the fault of the people of Lisbon if they were crushed in the earthquake: they should have never left the forest, no buildings to collapse on them"? Rousseau did not seem to notice that forests can be effing damp and cold. If tools started with the Homo Habilies well over two million years ago, it meant that inventing butchery was advantageous. Even "lymbically", as they found it preferable - surely emotionally preferable - than hunger, waste etc. We have been doing AI for a long time: and we quite normally meant "virtual professional". ("Computer" means "virtual computer [(the job)]"; "AI" stands for "virtual computer [(the job)] with less mechanical, routinary tasks".) This "«agency or self preservation goals»" idea is practically not impossible but an "holliwoodian" drift of the debate - entertaining thoughts replacing practical ones. If people act badly because of lack of wisdom, because of the hiatus between technological advance and personal advance (as we have been noticing at least for the past three centuries): they shall cultivate themselves. We do. Ignorance is societally the most massive problem, but it is a different problem. (Edit: sorry, not just and precisely "different": it is a related problem, because in fact we use Intelligence to acquire Wisdom. Intelligence is that thing that dissipates ignorance... That makes it a value. Synthetic, real Intelligence is meant to help against the devastating ignorance around.) That people fall from ladders or use them to hit people in the streets is not a sufficient note to suggest we should do without ladders - and lose the inherent perks.
- ChatGTP 3y ago
  Do you think AGI is different to a ladder ? Do you really believe an AGI would just be a tool in the traditional sense ? I guess it depends on our definition of AGI which doesn’t sound aligned
  - mdp2021 3y ago
    AGI means an entity that applies intelligent judgement over general problems. For the rest, you will have to be clearer.

mdp2021 3y ago

And you would think that remaining without tools could be better? Like in Rousseau's ideal? Such as "It is the fault of the people of Lisbon if they were crushed in the earthquake: they should have never left the forest, no buildings to collapse on them"? Rousseau did not seem to notice that forests can be effing damp and cold. If tools started with the Homo Habilies well over two million years ago, it meant that inventing butchery was advantageous. Even "lymbically", as they found it preferable - surely emotionally preferable - than hunger, waste etc. We have been doing AI for a long time: and we quite normally meant "virtual professional". ("Computer" means "virtual computer [(the job)]"; "AI" stands for "virtual computer [(the job)] with less mechanical, routinary tasks".) This "«agency or self preservation goals»" idea is practically not impossible but an "holliwoodian" drift of the debate - entertaining thoughts replacing practical ones. If people act badly because of lack of wisdom, because of the hiatus between technological advance and personal advance (as we have been noticing at least for the past three centuries): they shall cultivate themselves. We do. Ignorance is societally the most massive problem, but it is a different problem. (Edit: sorry, not just and precisely "different": it is a related problem, because in fact we use Intelligence to acquire Wisdom. Intelligence is that thing that dissipates ignorance... That makes it a value. Synthetic, real Intelligence is meant to help against the devastating ignorance around.) That people fall from ladders or use them to hit people in the streets is not a sufficient note to suggest we should do without ladders - and lose the inherent perks.

ChatGTP 3y ago
Do you think AGI is different to a ladder ? Do you really believe an AGI would just be a tool in the traditional sense ? I guess it depends on our definition of AGI which doesn’t sound aligned
- mdp2021 3y ago
  AGI means an entity that applies intelligent judgement over general problems. For the rest, you will have to be clearer.